Did they ever finish Image United? And calling Liefeld “the modern equivalent of Jack Kirby” is stupid.

Yeah calling it The Infinite fits cause it’ll probably never be finished.

Best quote I ever heard about Liefield:

“He has on a backwards cap, and when he turns it around, it’s still backwards.”

@redvector I think its more than stupid, its blasphemy quite frankly.

At least if the the old time traveler (doesn’t sound familiar) and the 19 year old look alike (and they will) there will be a reason rather than an excuse.

And yeah, he’s the modern equivalent of Kirby – just the vacuum, and not the King.

In no way is Rob Liefeld the new Jack Kirby. Where’s the endless invention, the restless creativity, the power and the poise? Liefeld would honestly seem to prefer doing *anything* but drawing – Kirby *lived* to draw (or drew to live, anyway). In terms of success, Liefeld is the opposite of Kirby – where Kirby grafted away his entire life for nickels and dimes, Liefeld has made millions from doing almost fuck all.

Do you think Liefeld has ever drawn a different nose, just to see what it feels like?

I’m impressed. Only two characters have utility belts and they’re the same person! The robot guy looks pretty cool though.

How come their mouths are closed?

I’ll buy BOTH issues!

That robot looking guy has that impossible physique that graces so many Liefeld characters…his chest…doesn’t quite line up with his body correctly. Not quite as bad as his infamous Captain America cover…but still. At least Kirby had a firm grasp on foreshortening…enough to exaggerate it and still have it work.

Kirkman? Yeah!! Liefeld? NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

Rob is the modern day Jack Kirby? WTF??????

This idea reminds me of another idea: http://www.hulu.com/watch/10310/saturday-night-live-bad-idea-jeans

most homoerotic costume design since Gary and Ace from Saturday Night Live

How Liefeld is still getting work mystifies me.

And the guns they’re carrying…I’ve seen nerf dart guns that look more menacing. They look like flashlights taped together.

Wait, the man who gave us “The Walking Dead” and “Invincible” thinks working with Rob Liefeld is a good idea? Blackmail must be involved somehow. We should start a fund or a petition to save Kirkman before it’s too late.

Why Kirkman? Why are your doing this? Expand the Invincible U and leave Liefeld out of it. Or, Liefeld can be an advisor to your work, but let someone draw it.

Still no feet!

Modern Day Jack Kirby? Man, my opinion of Kirkman just went waaaaaaay down…

That dude’s “cod piece” is more menacing that his guns and what’s with those “mufflers” sticking out of his chest??? 19 year old guy costume looks like a rip-off of the Multiple Man’s. What do those pouches hold? Breath mints? Robot guy and his sword look terribly uninspired. Ugh. For something that should garner interest in your project, this does not have any kind of ‘wow’ factor.

Besides, like this will ever come out and if does, actually wrap-up? Doubtful. Look at Image United. Did anyone care? I will never buy anything from the “Image Founders” based on their track record.

You’d think that Liefeld would have taken some of that money he’s made over the years and actually taken an anatomy class and learned how to draw or changed his style or stopped relying on pouches or learn how to draw guns that look like guns or… Guess not.

This project will never see the light of day, and if it does, the delays between issues will be epic. By the way, any updates on the Youngblood movie? That’s what I thought.

Kirkman has been saying Liefeld is this generations Kirby for years yet what does he base this on? just because Rob can s#&* out sucky character after sucky character does not make him efficient as Kirby, it just makes him a regurtitating machine.
Rob’s lasting legacy is Cable and Deadpool, both done under the umbrella of Marvel where he was supervised by an editor. Not even his baby Youngblood can stay in print for more than a dozen issues before it goes into limbo and gets rebooted years later.

It’s been 20 years since he left Marvel, what “classics” has he done all by himself? Actually i can name one: Cap Boobs.

Rob was so scared to tackle an Alan Moore script (an oportunity almost any artist would relish) he handed off the assignment to a more skilled artist, which was actually pretty smart on his part.

Liefeld = Kirby BWAHAHAHAHAHAH

For all the people who seem mystified by Kirkman’s lack of taste and are having their opinions of him altered, here’s a newsflash: Kirkman has always been mediocre, Invincible and The Walking Dead are just outliers from the output of his other work.

HDO’s comment made me laugh.

Also, is it me, or does the head on the robot guy bring to mind Garrus from the Mass Effect games?

What the hell is wrong with their faces? Are those two guys supposed to be twins? What’s with the nose Robber drew on the guy on the left? Kirkman really said Liefeld is his generation’s Jack Kirby? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@Evan G — they aren’t twins, they’re the same guy, just one is an older version of the other.

@CapCanuck – yep, the pouches, too. All over the place. Rob can’t not draw ‘em.

pouches: check

swords: check

no visible feet: check

wrists blocked by weird bracelets or gloves: check

asymmetrical boobs: check

Man, talk about a bunch of uninformed people taking smack on a chat board.

Like it or not, Rob was one of the most influential artists in the 90′s . . . and one of the best selling as well.

In terms of being “the modern day Jack Kirby”, take a look at the FEW characters launched at Marvel in the late 80′s and early 90′s that are still popular, support titles of their own, and are even in publishing rotation. Cable. Deadpool. Not a hell of a lot more. When Rob got the New Mutants title assigned to him, he kicked out a TON of awesome character designs for potential use. He’s done the same in his own Extreme, Maximum, and Awesome universe imprints.

And kids, Liefeld has always been highly regarded by Kirkman . . . Kirkman, as a kid, was a HUGE fan of Liefeld’s. Liefeld MAJORLY inspired Kirkman . . .

So, if you don’t like it, that’s cool. Don’t buy it. Just shut the **** up.

Not to defend Liefeld, considering the amount of mass frustration surrounding his business dealings, swiping work from fellow pros, not finishing projects and a predaliction to turn his back on work when Hollywood comes courting (wow that’s a lot of negatives and I didn’t even mention his talent)…where was I?

Oh yeah…He DID inspire a new wave of artists who copied his drawing format. It was dynamic and thought provoking in much the same way Kirby captured the imagination of a generation + of artists. Rob Liefeld, along with a handful of others, for a time breathed new life into a rather bland and generic medium.

But Rob’s time has past, his work is inconsistant and NOBODY emulates his style anymore. He carved out a niche in the 90’s but his work doesn’t hold the same relevance a man of Kirby’s style was able to maintain. I will be lambasted for this I’m sure, but Kirby got very lazy toward the end of his career and his best work is his ealy work.

Gene Colan kept a consistant style thorughout his entire career that although did not have the same vibrance of a Kirby, produced in my opinion an equally astounding body of work.

Steps off soapbox and returns to work.

Yeah he kicked out a “Ton of awesome character designs for potential use” and how many actually got used? And out side of Cable and Deadpool’s designs virtually none of them are being used today.

Cy, who are you trying to defend? Rob’s a multi-millionaire and very publicly doesn’t give a shit what his detractors think of him. He’s a big boy, he doesn’t need you defending his virtue or whatever you’re trying to do here.

LOL @ CyJohn…there’s a reason Rob is regarded as a joke. If we were uninformed, we wouldn’t be able to call it, know what I’m sayin’? And damn, RL”s was ugly way back when, and now. They touted him like he was supposed to be the next Art Adams or something.

@Cy John: Rob, is that you?

@Cy John — Saying someone was one of the most influential artists in the 90′s is like saying that person was the shiniest turd in the back yard. I kid but seriously the guy isn’t good and I don’t care how good his stuff sold either that doesn’t make him any better. Justin Bieber is one of the most popular people on the planet right now, go and listen to some of his music see if you can make it through two songs. Also what you said at the end there is pretty presumptuous. People are allowed to state their opinions on things.

Yeah he kicked out a “Ton of awesome character designs for potential use” and how many actually got used? And out side of Cable and Deadpool’s designs virtually none of them are being used today.

Actually, for his generation, that’s a lot. In fact, he has created the most characters with staying power and recognizability out of all his generation of artists. Jim Lee has what, Gambit. What about Larsen? Valentino? Portacio? Silvestri? Charest? Art Adams? And so on. I can’t really think of any creators from Liefeld’s era of later who created two or more characters with the staying power and recognizability that Cable and Deadpool.

And I’m no fan, I can’t stand Liefeld. It’s just that even I have to adimt creating those two is a big accomplishment.

““Ton of awesome character designs for potential use” and how many actually got used? ”

Most of them got used in the Mutant Liberation Front, both in New Mutants and later X-Force.

“Cy, who are you trying to defend? Rob’s a multi-millionaire and very publicly doesn’t give a shit what his detractors think of him. He’s a big boy, he doesn’t need you defending his virtue or whatever you’re trying to do here.”

HA! Should I apologize for trying to balance a lopsided attack on my all time favourite artist? I don’t think so.

“LOL @ CyJohn…there’s a reason Rob is regarded as a joke.”

If he’s such a “joke” . . . explain the HUGE sales during his heydey and his “multi-millionaire” status Chris Jones above mentions . . .

“If we were uninformed, we wouldn’t be able to call it, know what I’m sayin’? ”

Just being able to open one’s mouth and spout **** doesn’t make one informed.

“And damn, RL”s was ugly way back when, and now. They touted him like he was supposed to be the next Art Adams or something.”

Rob had the first million selling indy book. Ever. That’s something to be touted, I’d think.
And Art Adams TOTALLY rocks.

“@Cy John: Rob, is that you?”

Nah, if Rob’s going to post, he’s got the balls to do it under his own name.

“all time favourite artist”?????!?!!!!!! There is clearly something amiss.

according to Cy John, Liefeld has tiger blood and Adonis DNA

“centers on a soldier who travels back in time to recruit his 19-year-old self, and others, to help defeat a future world-conquering villain called The Infinite.”

Uh… exactly like what Badrock did in the last page of an issue of Youngblood but was never followed up on because the subsequent issues were never produced?

Yeah Kirkman, If Jack Kirby cribbed all of his ideas from his more talented peers and never completed anything consistently, then yeah, he’s like Jack.

So Cy John, why are all of us wrong? Please present reasons as to why you believe Rob Liefeld’s art is meritorious, and please leave sales figures out of your argument, as they have nothing to do with the quality of the artwork one way or another.

Generally I wouldn’t ask a homework assignment of another poster, but since you’re working from the assumption that everyone who doesn’t like Liefeld is simply ignorant as to his work’s positive qualities, I’d like to see what you think some of those positive qualities are.

OOOHHH shit more shit artwork from you know who! I’m saving my money.

Scud — ““all time favourite artist”?????!?!!!!!! There is clearly something amiss.” Whatever happened to your statement that “People are allowed to state their opinions on things”?

Keilj – “according to Cy John, Liefeld has tiger blood and Adonis DNA”. Ok, THAT was timely and funny.

Chris J. – Sales arguments don’t have anything to say with the quality of the work done? Really? Last time I checked, consumers vote with their wallets. Items they deem as holding some level of qualty (value) get purchased; items without value don’t. The work of EVERY artist is subjective, so it would be an exercise in futility to attempt to purseude others regarding “positive qualities” of work.

According to Cy John, more money equals “better than.” How much money did van Gogh make? Practically nothing? Hack. Rob Liefeld, a millionaire, is obviously better. Twighlight curb stomps Citizen Kane in quality. And Beiber is laughing at all those talentless bimbos like Mozart.

McDonalds is obviously the pinnacle of the culinary experience.

@CyJohn You say
“Sales arguments don’t have anything to say with the quality of the work done? Really? Last time I checked, consumers vote with their wallets.”
Yeah, and how many of Robs books do you see in the quarter bins? Tons. Sales numbers are scued because they dont represent what the actual public is buying but rather what comic shops are on the hoook for.

“Items they deem as holding some level of qualty (value) get purchased; items without value don’t”
Really? you havent you heard of buyers remorse? “Damn, sure wish i didnt buy this p.o.s.”

” The work of EVERY artist is subjective, so it would be an exercise in futility to attempt to purseude others regarding “positive qualities” of work.”
In other words you cant point out one single quality in Robs work. Gotcha.

The whole 90′s revival that’s been going on for the past little while is so painful…I used to think that Liefeld was pretty good as an artist…because he drew at about the same level as me…I was a teenager with little understanding of drawing anatomy.

Why can’t we get back punk rock Rogue? With the black body sock and torn green shirt? Mohawk Storm? Shirtless Colossus? Brown and Tan Wolverine? Good times. No pouches. No Flashlight/dildo/nerf guns.

Tween girls have better taste than anybody. I will now start subscribing to 13-year old girls’ vlog and twitter accounts in hopes of gaining insight to their wisdom.

“Sales arguments don’t have anything to say with the quality of the work done? Really? Last time I checked, consumers vote with their wallets. Items they deem as holding some level of qualty (value) get purchased; items without value don’t. The work of EVERY artist is subjective, so it would be an exercise in futility to attempt to purseude others regarding “positive qualities” of work.”

So at this point you’ve either gotta answer my question or stop belittling people who disagree with you, because it really doesn’t look like you have a leg to stand on here.

You know, I really hate that “art is subjective” argument, because it really opens up the doors to the idea that it doesn’t matter WHAT you make looks like it’s intrinsically equal to every other piece of art. And then talent is determined by monetary success.

HA HA HA HA HA HA.

ME? Belitting? Wow. What a way to bend the whole situation . . . want to see hate and flamed filled posts? Look at almost every one prior to my first post. There ya go.

I don’t “gotta” do anything, Chris.

Eddie V H – so sad to read your posts. I was a big fan of yours back in the 80′s. Heh.

“Yeah, and how many of Robs books do you see in the quarter bins? Tons. Sales numbers are scued because they dont represent what the actual public is buying but rather what comic shops are on the hoook for.”

Oh, definitely some, although more from other titles in the studio than from Rob himself. While I’m looking through those quarter bins, I also see a lot of 90′s titles from Marvel, DC, other Image imprints, Valiant, and a slew of indies. I worked in comic shops in the 90′s. Those titles sold and sold very well. Not all quarter bin books are new old stock. Some are re-aquired through trades, purchases, liqudations, and people getting rid of comic collections as they get older. To somehow make the suggestion that Rob’s personal work gluts all quarter bins is rubbish.

“Really? you havent you heard of buyers remorse? “Damn, sure wish i didnt buy this p.o.s.”

What does the divorce rate in the US have to do with this?

“In other words you cant point out one single quality in Robs work. Gotcha.”

That’s not it. Just not going to bother, to be honest. I dare you to convince me that Picasso is quality work. Looks like horse poop on acid to me. Even if you make every intelligent argument about the “quality” of work, it’ll still look like horse poop on acid to me. Art enjoyment is subjective.

LOL @ Another Ian — “Flashlight/dildo/nerf guns”…LMFAO!!!!!

Leave it to Rob to successfully make metallic objects look like squishy spraypainted foam.

@EVH …what about those big, puffy barrel chests Rob is good at? That (in)famous Cap drawing has to count for something, doesn’t it? Maybe it can be used in an ad campaign for back pain medication. LOL!

Here’s the problem with Rob Liefield. Sure, he created a bunch of character designs, but that doesn’t really take much talent. The talent actually comes in when you execute an idea. RL may have come up with the idea of a time travelling soldier from the future or an unkillable, loudmouthed assasin, but then other people wrote and drew the hundreds of issues that made the characters great while RL jumped from one vapid splash page to the next.

And as far as saying that the sales of X-Force #1 automatically imply that Rob’s work is good goes, I would like to point out that a millioin different people didn’t buy one copy each. All the comic shops bought a total of a million books together. Speculators bought five copies each. It was basically Marvel tricking a bunch of 12 year olds into buying the same product over and over again. That doesn’t really seem like something to brag about to me. I mean, the marketing people who came up with the bag and trading card gimic should be proud of the money they made, but it’s no artistic achievement. How many entire long boxes full of X-Force #1 have you seen in quater bins in the twenty years since it came out? I know I’ve seen more than a few.

Making fun of Rob Liefield is easy and fun. He should do press releases more often.

In the three minutes it took me to compose a response, like ten people jumped on here and made my point for me.

The thought process that Rob shouldn’t be held in high regard b/c his creations were made great by others is silly. The highest selling issues that had Deadpool in them are still the NM & X-Force issues that Rob drew. And yes – high sales do mean something. I don’t think CBG puts out a list of the highest regarded comics of the month, nor does Marvel or DC or any company tell a creator, “we don’t care about sales! Just make the comic snobs rave about what you do and then we’ll be happy!”

I think that since we’ve all made fun of Rob now, we should all take a moment to mention any work he’s done that we did like.

…somebody else can go first.

Robs personal work involves any comic with his name in it, that means anything that came out of Extreme, Maximum and Awesome. And i assure you those comics flood the quarter bins.

So you say Picasso is horse poop, then it shouldnt be much a problem labeling Robs art as horse poop, too.

Quarter bins? Try the dime boxes on the outside folding table by every shop’s front door with a little Sharpie pen-scribbled sign that reads “Give them a home…PLEASE!!!!”

@ Terry
“The thought process that Rob shouldn’t be held in high regard b/c his creations were made great by others is silly”
Really? Why? How many Deadpool appearances has Rob written? Not draw, written. Because if the character is handled badly by writers the character will fade into oblivion. See Ghost Rider, Punisher and Venom.

“The highest selling issues that had Deadpool in them are still the NM & X-Force issues that Rob drew.”
Coincidentally enough bad comics still sold over 100, 000 issues back then, whats yor point?

“And yes – high sales do mean something.”
Yes, it means comic book stores bought them in bunches, how many of those bagged X-Froce #1 do you see in quarter bins? LOTS

Alan Moore’s Supreme and Youngblood stuff was really good. Rob didn’t write or draw that stuff, but it’s my favorite stuff he had anything to do with. I guess we could call getting Alan Moore to do a really good Superman ripoff is kind of an artistic success on Rob’s part. It was like reading Whatever happend to the Man of Tomorrow as a continuing monthly series.

Pull out the late issues of NM and Rob’s X-Force issues. Stories by Rob. Fabian just scripted.

“I think that since we’ve all made fun of Rob now, we should all take a moment to mention any work he’s done that we did like.

…somebody else can go first.”

I think that when he has to draw static, pose-y images, he can actually generate a fair amount of excitement and energy with his drawings. Like, I don’t really have any problems with the image that this article uses.

“Pull out the late issues of NM and Rob’s X-Force issues. Stories by Rob. Fabian just scripted”

Those issues were okay superhero books, but nothing really that special. I mean, I bought them as a kid, but there’s nothing there to hold my interest now that I’m an adult. Not that appealing to adults was the goal of anyone involved with NM or X-Force, but RL has yet to do anything better. Can anyone point out any work that RL has done that would be good enough to, say, show to someone who doesn’t read comics regularly? It’s been twenty five years of work on his part and I can’t think of anything. I mean nothing. Remind me of some of his really great work if you can.

@Blarg my point was that the highest selling comics that have DP appearances in them were written by Rob, and was in response to EVH saying what issues were written by Rob..

@Cy John — I do believe people are allowed to state their opinions on things. I’m not trying to tell you that you can’t express it but its terrible. Also the whole “I’m not even gonna bother to tell you why I like _______. I dare you to tell me why you like ________.” just goes to further the fact that there is nothing good to say about him and I really just think you’re a troll at this point. Rob Liefeld sucks and he is a bane on art period. I really wouldn’t even be here talking trash still if the comparison to Kirby wasn’t made. That’s like comparing Hitler to Bambi.

@ Terry
Highest selling doesnt mean they’re the best stories. So i ask again, how many issues with Deadpool in them has Rob written and which of those are worth mentioning?

@Terry. Didn’t mean to quote you out of context. Sorry to use your words to get to a somewhat seperate point.

I guess my whole thing on here is that every time Rob does a press release we all take turns taking cheap shots, which to me is what makes chatrooms fun, but Rob always has a few strong defenders. It leaves me feeling like maybe Rob did some good stuff that I just never heard about. I haven’t looked at anything of his since Supreme, which he wasn’t even that involved in artistically.

Actually, pairing himself up with Kirkman is a great move on his part. He’s got a strong writer for this project at least. If he can up his game artwise, this might just work. But he really needs to wow us with the art. I mean, he needs to really show us what he’s learned over the last couple decades. If he’s not going to do that, then he needs to just go away. Rob puts up with so much sh*t talking from comics fans, he must want to impress us. It’s time for him to either prove his detractors wrong or retire.

Is his future self the robot? and his 19-year old version the girl?

I don’t Rob Liefeld is Jack Kirby of the 90s but he’s had a mostly positive effect on the industry. He had a hand creating two of the most lasting X-characters in Cable and Deadpool. He made the first Image comic in Youngblood #1.

You have to love a man who is in a Levis commercial discussing comic books with Spike Lee.

You know what bothers me the most about Liefeld?

That he has not ever addressed any of the issues his art had 20+ years ago.

No progression, no self awareness. No acknowledgement of his own limitations or sense that he wants to improve as an artist. As far as Liefeld is concerned, he’s always been awesome and why bother growing as an artist?

Rob Liefeld is a shallow and lazy artist.

I’ve spent 30,000 dollars on art college to learn to draw. Its sort of disheartening to see bad anatomy from a guy who’s been a “comic artist” for year, and to the best of my knowledge he doesn’t have any training.

What’s up with that, world?

Also, calling him the “Modern Jack Kirby” is just an insult. That title should really go to someone who’s doing innovative stuff, like Chris Ware or someone like that.

Rob Liefeld is the Modern Rob Liefeld. To call him the modern “anyone else” would be an insult, unless that person never drew anything more than stick figures in their lives. Even the people “under” him at Image surpassed him years ago…

If we’re picking a “Modern Jack Kirby” I nominate Scottie Young… just from an artistic standpoint…

Modern Jack Kirby = Skottie Young? Hell no. Talented artist, but no other impact at all as far as I can tell.
As far as Rob goes, I have a twisted fascination with his life and work. By now everyone knows what to expect from him so I don’t really get the genuine hate people tend to express. Also the attempts at comedy in the comments are not the peak of what I’ve seen in Liefeld threads. The comment referencing Charlie Sheen is sort of apt in that both Charlie and Rob are equally delusional about their talent and worth.

So, Internet Fans hate Rob Liefeld, and nothing is too far rhetorically to slam the guy. In other news, the sky is blue, the pope is catholic and bears poop in the woods. The art looks better than a lot of Liefeld art I’ve seen, and I’m cautiously looking forward to this.

Modern Day Kirby should be someone who’s doing prolific thing that haven’t been done in comics before. At this point its a hard thing to say since we’ve come so far from Jack Kirby’s time. I’d nominate Mike Mignola since he’s doing great at writing an awesome universe, as well as pushing an art style that not many others are working with.

All of Rob’s fans are embarrassed about their buying habits and that’s why we defend him? Seriously? Contradict yourself much? So lemme get this straight….I’m embarrassed that I’m a fan, so I publicly defend him. Riiiight. That makes sooo much sense. Hey Lead Sharp, I quit reading your last post after the 1st paragraph when it was obvious you were more interested in trying to be clever than anything else.

@ Terry
“@Evan G — they aren’t twins, they’re the same guy, just one is an older version of the other.”

If theyr’e twins why is one so much taller than the other? Is he wearing Gene Simmons’ KISS boots?

@Terry

I love people like you you make me feel all glowy and warm inside

@DrunkJack: Nailed it. Plus also, the other thing that bothers me about Liefeld is how much his art sucks giant chorizo sausage.

Jack Kirby could turn out 5 or 6 books a month and all by the deadline, Liefeld can’t even manage to do 1 bi-monthly. How many books has Liefeld started over the years that haven’t gotten past issue 3? Liefeld is a hack no if-and-or-buts. He peaked at age 21 he must be over 40 by now and his skills as an artist haven’t progressed one bit.

I think a more fitting description of Rob Liefeld is ‘the modern day Ed Wood”.
Seriously, that guy’s standards are very low.