Robot 6

One Million Moms targets DC, Marvel over gay storylines

One Million Moms, the conservative Christian initiative that launched an unsuccessful campaign in February urging Toys “R” Us to stop selling the issue of Life with Archie depicting the wedding of gay character Kevin Keller, has now turned its attention to Marvel and DC Comics.

A project of the nonprofit American Family Association, which is designated as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center, One Million Moms has sounded the alarm about this week’s twin announcements that DC will reintroduce one of its “major iconic” characters as gay, and that Marvel will wed Northstar to his boyfriend Kyle Jinadu in Astonishing X-Men #51.

“Children desire to be just like superheroes,” reads the missive on the One Million Moms website. “Children mimic superhero actions and even dress up in costumes to resemble these characters as much as possible. Can you imagine little boys saying, ‘I want a boyfriend or husband like X-Men?’ This is ridiculous! Why do adult gay men need comic superheroes as role models? They don’t but do want to indoctrate [sic] impressionable young minds by placing these gay characters on pedestals in a positive light. These companies are heavily influencing our youth by using children’s superheroes to desensitize and brainwash them in thinking that a gay lifestyle choice is normal and desirable. As Christians, we know that homosexuality is a sin (Romans 1:26-27).”

The notice goes on to assert that, “Children do not know what straight, homosexual, or coming out of the closet even means, but DC Comics and Marvel are using superheroes to confuse them on this topic to raise questions and awareness of an alternative lifestyle choice. These companies are prompting a premature discussion on sexual orientation.”

One Million Moms, whose membership falls far, far short of that number, if its Facebook page is any indication, calls on parents to email DC and Marvel and urge them to “change and cancel all plans of homosexual superhero characters immediately. Ask them to do the right thing and reverse their decision to have sexual orientation displayed to readers.”

Oddly enough, the letter also references the group’s failed bid to have Life With Archie #16 pulled from shelves by Toys “R” Us (“Toys ‘R’ Us had the audacity to display ‘Archie- Just Married’ at the front of the store by the checkout counters”). The effort apparently backfired, as the issue quickly sold out. Around the same time, One Million Moms launched a boycott against JC Penney for hiring lesbian talk-show host Ellen DeGeneres as its spokeswoman. That effort too quickly fizzled.

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247 Comments

If only there were one million kids picking up comics every week.

“Can you imagine little boys saying, ‘I want a boyfriend or husband like X-Men?’ This is ridiculous!”
Yes. Yes, that IS ridiculous, OMM. Everything you say is ridiculous.

These people do realize there are several conclusive scientific studies that show that being gay is not a choice, right? You can’t pray out the gay, same as reading gay superheroes won’t “turn” you gay. You are either born gay or you are not, which makes me ask the question – why does God make something a sin that he has placed out of your control? Why are gay couples, according to the Catholic Church, not allowed to partake in the physical act of lovemaking (they have stated it is okay to be gay though) other wise it is a sin, when essentially it was God that made partners of the opposite sex biologically unsuitable to them? Maybe the Million Moms should answer those questions before they but their nose into comics where they don’t belong.

I don’t even think there are 12 moms in this group. Why do you give them the time of day. Remember comics aren’t just for kids anymore.

Yet again, violence equals good and sex equals bad. Welcome to America.

This is ridiculous! Why do adult gay men need comic superheroes as role models?

They don’t but maybe gay teens need these role models.

People should quote scripture in press releases more often. It’s REALLY persuasive.

Yup. One million stupid f$%#ing moms.

Everylast one of those people need to be hit with a truck.

I disagree with these people but these days the Southern Poverty Law Center pretty much calls everyone to right of Obama a “hate group.” That term used to mean something, ie, groups that engaged in violence, not boycotts or stupid comments.

I agree that the Bible says homosexuality is a sin. I think that the Bible is God’s true word to us. But I also agree with RunnerX13′s above.

Why is the sin of homosexuality in comics more offensive than the sin of fornication? Or the sin of cursing or lying or adultery or idolatry? I read comics every day and I disagree with a lot of the actions of the heroes.

Do I wish they would clean up the heroes a little? Yeah, here and there…would I rather the comics not depict something that the Bible says is wrong as right? Yes. BUT WHY THE DOUBLE STANDARD?

The fact that this many backwards neanderthals reproduced is simply frightening. Fortunately I don’t live in the US.

Did anyone NOT see this coming?

Wait, young children still read comics!?? What is this foolishness? This is obviously simply a misinformed group of hate mongers masquerading as Christians with a so-called moral agenda. Kids reading about gay marriage aren’t any more likely to want boyfriends or to marry members of the same-sex because of a comic book (at least not as kids anyway) then they are to want to jump off roofs to mimic flying… oh wait. Seriously though, there is some kernel of a point to what Moms against Stuff are saying, and it’s that comics don’t really have to follow reality this closely in order to appeal to kids. Problem is comics aren’t just for kids anymore, so adult themes like gay marriage may not be appropriate for little Jimmy but may be entirely appropriate for his gay/straight/bi/transgender uncle or older brother. That’s why comics come with ratings, are located in specific ‘kid friendly’ sections. Go into any decently informed comic shop these days and they can point a kid and his/her mom to appropriate material. Just as an issue of Playboy sitting on the same magazine rack as Mad magazine or a benign comic book may not be okay for little Jimmy, all comics are obviously not created equal. And if little Jimmy does happen to get ahold of the gay marriage issue of Alpha Flight he may just learn something, something his Mom could stand to learn a little about- – tolerance.

I love how these are positive relationships that the Million Moms are protesting. Two men entering a monogamous relationship built on love and trust is a bad example to kids, but Starfire and Catwoman having flippant throw away sex is fine since its male and female.

“Anonymous

May 24, 2012 at 3:04 pm

These people do realize there are several conclusive scientific studies that show that being gay is not a choice,right?”

Actually “Anonymous” there are absolutley zero conclusive scientific studies showing that being gay is not a choice.

I’m agree. This is something awful to the kids because they are who buy comics and they need good entertaiment, not homosexual themes

No one is “brainwashed” as good as the members of those associations are. Pathetic.

Well, let’s try not to answer intolerance with intolerance of our own

But I agree with the comment above – hardly any kids even read comics anymore

@C Fox—who would “choose” a “lifestyle” (I hate that word so much) that will lead to their constant oppression? Who would choose to make their own life difficult. More to the point–who cares who other people choose to sleep with?

Anyway, Million Moms make me embarrassed to say I am a Christian.

One Million Moms, go to hell. Take your outdated homophobic and travel back to the 80s where it was relavent.

Everybody has the right to voice their opinion on the matter…plain and simple.

@Anonymous I disagree with what you said about homosexuals. Some are born and some are made based on events that have happened in a person’s life and there is research on that too.

Ultimately as a Christian, it is a choice from the perspective that you choose to live the lifestyle and practices that come along with being homosexual/bisexual etc., The act itself is in offense to God…who created man and woman to be partners. When they sinned in the garden…they opened a “pandora’s box” that has twisted everything God created. All I’m seeing now is prophecy being fulfilled.

You can ultimately choose to believe it or not. Don’t be afraid to check out the truth in the Word. God Bless everybody.

if I was a kid I think I would be more exited to be able to get cool mutant powers than being gay

kinda stupid when you consider all the amazing powers X-Men got kids would be more inclined to pretend that their Wolverine, Cyclops, etc. than pretend their gay and start listening to Justin Beiber

Is OMM some kind of splinter PR group? Like you just call them whenever you need to drum up attention for something LGBTQ-related that you’re doing and then they act outraged for a fee?

OMM should blame Moms. They’re the ones who keep having gay babies.

I’m going troll their page.

…yeah… Clearly these women don’t read comics. They’ve hardly been an exclusively child-aimed medium for a LOOOOOONG time. What with all the killing, dismemberment, rape, drug abuse, etc… that occur in nearly every super-hero comic being printed today. Seems odd they’re against two consenting adults started a life together and showing nothing but love and joy, but they’re okay with Wolverine cute a man’s head off or Spider-Man selling his marriage to Satan, or Sue Dibney being raped.

And regardless of whether or not comics are aimed at children, gay people exist. They are all kinds of people, who we interact with every day. They’re friends, co-workers, family members, and so on. And there are children who themselves are gay. Why shouldn’t they have a positive role model? Someone who tries to help people, who wants to have a family, and who just wants to be happy with someone who cares unconditionally for them?

Gay means happy after all. And considering how dark things can get in the real world and in comics, I think we could all use a bit more happy instead of being bigots, judgemental and mean to people.

As Louis CK would say:

“It doesn’t have ANY effect on your life. What do you care? People try to talk about it like it’s a social issue. Like when you see someone stand up on a talk show and say ‘How am I supposed to explain to my child that two men are getting married?’ I dunno, it’s your shitty kid, you fuckin’ tell ‘em. Why is that anyone else’s problem? Two guys are in LOVE but they can’t get married because YOU don’t want to talk to your ugly child for five fuckin’ minutes?”

C Fox couldn’t be more correct. How come Christans are so noble all of a sudden. Do they forget about those bottom feeders like Jim Baker and those who steal from the misinformed like Ernest Ashley. I thought Jesus said to love thy neighbour. If Jesus was here today I feel he’d be ashamed of those who call themselves Christian.

Science, schmience, bible, schmible, perversity, schmerversity… In the end, I’m straight and my mom is still worth more than every single one of these alleged “millions of mothers” who are just plain wrong. Ad infinitum.

So, OMM. I’m asking you, not so kindly, to sod off. ‘Nuff said.

I think if our children learned more about (and a respect for) relationships, sex, sexual identity, male/female anatomy, etc. earlier we’d be in a much better place as a society right now.

Better not tell OMM they are mutants…Then all hell would break loose.

@B.C. — “Some are born and some are made based on events that have happened in a person’s life and there is research on that too.”

I absolutely agree with this statement and thank you for having the cojones to say it. Those who argue this are in fact the narrowminded ones.

These people are fighting against comic books….over a subject that shouldn’t really be an issue in this day and age….Can you say “No life?”

“C Fox couldn’t be more correct.”

Sorry I take it back. Being gay is not a choice, but god created them that way. Sorry I misread

@Red Robin: Extremely well put. You are now MY superhero.

You know Magneto was right don’t you? lol

I whole heartedly agree that some where in the bible in mentions something about homosexuality being a sin or some drivel like that. It doesn’t make it right, in fact it makes the book rather dated and silly.

There I said it, the bible is out of touch and rather silly.

“Indoctrate”; priceless.

Too bad it wasn’t 1 Million Lesbians! *wink* *wink* *nudge* *nudge*…

Or DC, 1 Million, Lesbian BatWoman…

@Lucas — “No life” is the label reserved for all the Ninety-Nine Percenters who camped out for weeks and accomplished absolutely nothing.

Astonishing X-Men #51 was covered on MSN News. Anything that gets high profile coverage is going to be noticed. So 1MM printed some message on their website. So what?

@B.C. Wow. I know a considerable number of Americans believe that Genesis is literally true but as someone with a life sciences background this always makes my jaw drop. But whatever floats your boat…

Regarding research on homosexuality, several factors come into play (genetics, epigenetics, uterine environment etc). For instance, your chances of being gay are much higher than chance if your identical twin is also gay. Environmental factors are also important, but no serious research gives any credence to the idea that someone can consciously *choose* their sexual orientation.

Hey 1 Million Moms, if you want to drive readers away from comics, too late. The sucky storylines and endless crossovers have already done that

Yeah, well, just like Archie Comics, they’re not going to take this crap. Besides, if they do, a lot of my favorite characters will cease to exist. Like Batwoman! She’s sooo cool!

Anywhozle, don’t take this crap from the hate groups, Marvel and DC!

It all comes down to this: if you don’t like something, don’t buy it. I don’t think Jesus would waste his time protesting fictional literature. Let’s take that energy and put it toward something Jesus would be proud of like feeding the homeless, participating in a program like Big Brothers Big Sisters, helping people who are having problems paying bills, donating money to childhood illnesses, volunteering at local nursing homes…. You’d think that fictional literature was the most evil thing in the world. (Full disclosure: I am a Christian.)

“Why do adult gay men need comic superheroes as role models?” They don’t, but gay teens struggling with their emerging sexuality sure could use positive reinforcement from popular culture, rather than the hateful denial of their nature from One Million Morons.

Duff McWhalen

May 24, 2012 at 3:44 pm

ahh, and now the big two have a senseless, worthless enemy to give them credibility.

hey, wasn’t Marko gone after his public bellyaching about how Marvel treated him?

I wasn’t going to respond, but I had when I read this comment by B.C.: “it is a choice from the perspective that you choose to live the lifestyle and practices that come along with being homosexual/bisexual etc., The act itself is in offense to God”

It is this way of thinking that’s directly responsible for so man suicides of gay teens, and depression in gay youth. This mind set teaches kids that who they ARE is wrong and should be repressed. Study after study, kid after kid, this has shown to directly cause the suicides and depression in gay youth. I hope you know that you, by publicizing this fallacy, are directly responsible for what these poor kids are doing. Shame on you.

One Million Lazy Moms

May 24, 2012 at 3:45 pm

I think homosexuality is neither simply a choice nor something you’re born with.

Romans 1:26-27 doesn’t say anything about sinfulness. It says god punished some folks that were up to some kinky sex stuff. It’s basically propaganda for Roman citizens to choose christianity over their current or non-existent religion. It’s the old school version of Pat Roberson saying that god caused the Haiti earthquake. However if you’re a believer that thinks the bible is 100% accurate despite all evidence to the contrary, then you’re gonna see what you wanna see which is support for your ingrained prejudices.

There’s no such thing as a “premature discussion on sexual orientation.” There’s the conversation you don’t want to have which makes you a lazy parent. Some kids have two parents of the same sex from the time they’re born, and if you don’t live in the backwards part of the world, your kid might enjoy being friends with that kid. Long before they read a comic book your kid might ask you “why does Tommy have 2 dads instead of a mom and a dad like I do?” It’s never premature to have this discussion when you’re not someone living in fear of homosexuals and hating them for existing.

Forget being embarrassed for being a christian. I’m embarrassed by humanity.

silly Christians, keep your made up stories away from my made up stories and we won’t have a problem

OK I get it your God finds it offensive but you know what? My God doesn’t. So please tell your God to mind his own business. Homosexuality has been around since at least biblical times and look here we still are.

It’s unfortunate that these people still cling to bible verses as the be-all, end-all of how the world and its ways are interpreted. They’re lemmings. I hope their children realize sooner rather than later the backwards thinking that is being imposed on them by people who are supposed to easing them into the world as it is, not giving them predisposed, discriminatory biased opinions of what is. It’s easy to judge others and overlook your own sins, which can easily be used to demonize them.

By the way, ladies, they’re f*cking comic books. Why don’t you do something productive – recycle, volunteer at the homeless shelter, help cure HIV/AIDS, play on the freeways in black clothing.

mostlyharmless

May 24, 2012 at 3:47 pm

@B.C. and E.G.

I have read and investigated countless studies..biological and pychological, and have never seen a credible one (i.e. one that is not conducted by a Fundamentalist Christian organization) that shows that “some fay people are made based on events that have happened in a person’s life”.

In fact just the opposite is true. Claims that homosexuality is “caused” by events or enviornment have been soundly debunked.

Anybody who reads X-Men books and is homophobic is an idiot.

Million Mums says email DC and Marvel and “Ask them to do the right thing and reverse their decision to have sexual orientation displayed to readers.”

They’re about 75 years too late there, ever since Superman & Lois first kissed back in 1938.

On the other hand, it means Marvel doesn’t have to worry about trying to think of a way to remarry Peter & MJ.

I think Christians should be fed to the lions like they were back in the good old days. Just round all of them up after their bible thumping class and let the fun begin.

Or better yet, beat them to death with their bibles.

Maybe then the inbreeding will stop.

Oh please…yet another reason why I can’t stand fundamentalist Christians. Guess turn the other cheek, judge not lest ye be judged and love thy neighbor doesn’t count for much to these “women” does it?

Live and let live.

It’s great everyone has a chance to relate to someone like them in pop culture.

Whether or not people are gay by choice is a red herring. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a choice or not. People choose whether to be Christians or not, but nonetheless, most of us would frown upon discriminating against a person simply because they were a Christian. People choose their political beliefs, yet most of us would agree that it is wrong for the state to discriminate against someone simply because of their political beliefs.

All that matters is whether homosexuality or homosexual relationships are moral or immoral. I have yet to see a single rational argument that homosexuality is immoral*. Game over man, game over.

*Please note that “Eew, it’s icky!”, “It says so in a book.” and “My imaginary friend says it’s bad.” are not rational arguments.

@mostlyharmless — How do you explain a gay man later having “straight” relationships with women…by choice? Is he living a lie? Would you tell him that?

There are numerous instances of homosexual behavior derived from environmental factors, e.g. a child molested by the pedo uncle, or a gay teen.

If you can provide incontrovertible proof that homosexuality is 100% established in the womb, without grey areas or X factors, I will shut up.

@BC All you see is the “Prophecy” coming true? I hope you aren’t referring to Revelations? Do look up the historical record of when that lovely piece of fiction was written, the context it was written in and furthermore do look up the term “Gematria.” Gematria was a favourite mystical practice by early Greeks, Jews and Christians to assign numbers to letters. That infamous 666 in Revelations is there because the emperor Nero (persecutor of Christians) just so happens to fit into the pattern of gematria and appears in Ancient Greek text (you know, the language the Gospels were originally written in). How do we know this? Because when manuscripts of Revelation, written in Hebrew, turn up the number is not 666, but 616 to reflect the differences between the Greek and Hebrew alphabet. Historical facts are always problematic to the unquestioning “believers.”

Good writers should go after DC for using the revelation that a character is gay in 2012 as a selling point.
Because being gay is special now i guess.

It’s like comics are seducing the innocent! Someone should write a book.

@EG–ever hear of bi-sexuals? Some people don’t see their sexuality as an immutable identity–some people see their sexuality as acts they perform and not who they “are.”

First of all, it is NOT a choice to be gay. I’ve seen the studies. One involved looking at the primal part of the brain that registers when we are “turned on,” and they’ve found the correlation that gay men have the same switch that goes off when they smell a certain chemical in male sweat that happens in female brains. It’s unalterable brain chemistry that is beyond your ability to control without making some kind of unnatural medical alterations we aren’t capable of yet. It’s a physical manifestation of your sexual orientation that you have no control over, which helps show that it’s not a choice.

There was another study that measured blood to… certain areas that would be too lewd to mention on such a reputable site. They took gay, straight and bisexual men and measured their involuntary response to certain pornographic images, and then were shown nonsexual images to, how do I say this, “cleanse the palette” before showing them the next one. What they found was that straight men were turned on only by what was deemed straight porn, gay men were turned on only by the gay porn, and interestingly, not a single bi-sexual man was turned on by both types of images (which is a whole different can of worms irrelevant to this conversation). Which kind of proves the point – if gay were a life choice, some of the gay men should still have been turned on by the straight porn, right?, since biology dictates that on a primal level they should still have straight urges to procreate. BUT they didn’t. Gay is all about biology, not psychology, and the former is beyond our personal control in this case.

However… I’m also a firm believer that sexual orientation is beyond the narrow confines of science. For one, none of the studies I’ve seen take lesbians into account. Perhaps being a lesbian is a choice? It’s not for me to say. and what about transgender and transsexual? I’ve also read the phrase before that being married to a woman and having children doesn’t necessarily make you straight, nor does having sex with men make you gay, which confuses things more. How does that fit in? I can’t say, and it goes beyond the main point of my post, which is that OMM is a group of hypocrites. Their God involved biology in sexual orientation; for some people it may be a choice, but for many others, it IS NOT, and that is hypocrisy, so to even bring religion into their argument is a problem. Two people who are in the love have the right to get married just as much as anyone else, regardless of their partner’s gender, and everyone else needs to mind their own business because no matter how much they try to make it a social issue, IT DOESN’T AFFECT YOU IF YOU AREN’T ONE OF THE PEOPLE GETTING MARRIED..

OMM, stay out of my business, stay out of other peoples lives, you fascist whores…..

The good news is that having a fundamentalist organization against you is usually good for sales, right?

These morons are losing the battle – and thank god for that – because they are failing to grasp a very central aspect of all of this: these comics are doing this to reflect what is actually happening in the REAL WORLD, not because they have a secret agenda to effect use their FICTIONAL WORLDS to effect change.

Question: So, suppose homosexuality was a choice, and that no scientific study ever successfully concludes that it’s a question of genetics?

Answer: It doesn’t and shouldn’t make a damn bit of difference whether it is genetics or if it is purely a choice. If it’s a choice, it’s a choice people have a right to make in an enlightened society as far as I am concerned.

And you know what? If two consenting people are in love, and want to get married, anyone that wants to stop them can go to hell.

Seriously, this group – while it should never be taken too lightly – has all the hallmarks of the last trumpeted fart sounding on ailing sphincter.

You know the bad part? They won’t succeed. And that’s bad because both comics are shit for reasons unrelated to homosexuality and would be better off cancelled.

Gay groups should form a counter organization to these idiot moms. I’m proposing One Million Gays… or, OMG.

:-)

That should make those wacky fundamentalists squirm, eh?

Duff McWhalen

May 24, 2012 at 4:11 pm

Thought about it, and I’m gonna have a boycott of my own for this comic, and others like it. Because I’d really like to see them do something with being gay in comics other than use it to pick up buzz and possible sales. OMM is probably just some ‘heel’ group used to put this kinda stuff over.

Seriously, nobody cares about Northstar and who is Kyle? Is he related to Danny Glover? Cause I see him sitting next to Puck. What other relevance does this story have?

@Marc C — If “some people see their sexuality as ‘acts they perform’ and not who they are,” the “born gay” concept is undermined. Try-anything-sexual’s is different from bisexuality.

@Anonymous — There is nothing in the study you quoted that negates the notion of “homosexual” subjects having been aroused by images of straight porn or nude females in times past. One would literally require an unabridged chronology of multiple willing subjects in order to weigh the data. Who’s going to fund that study?

A Comic Book Fan

May 24, 2012 at 4:16 pm

This whole thing is sad. This organization wants to get press and attention by making their statement. We, the actual comic buying public, make many a comment about what idiots they are. We need to keep the high ground and ignore silly stuff like this. I doubt many if any of the members of that group buy comic for their kids anyway.

Hope everyone has a great (& safe) Memorial Day weekend. :)

I would freaking drop the El Mondo Stinkbomb on One Million Moms if I had the chance–and that Bible verse they cite is a fake.

TwistedBishop

May 24, 2012 at 4:16 pm

More like “One Million Facepalms”.

Ashe Darkthorne

May 24, 2012 at 4:19 pm

The Million Mom group are a bunch of hate mongering nut jobs. I would never worry about anything they do. They go after anything they do not like without Rhyme or Reason. The reasons these characters are being either introduced as Gay or reintroduced into marriage is because it is what is going on in the world. Where Marvel has always kept their heroes in real world areas and dealing with issues that the current generation is dealing with. DC has always done things in their universe along the same side. People tend to forget that just because the books are “superhero” books and nothing is relative to what people deal with. That is idiot thinking and this group is a prime example. They use it as a publicity stunt to lure more idiotic lost fools to their causes. Shame that they are so desperate to go after Comics.

Yes, because that worked out so well with JC and Ellen. Doubt they’re even one million; more like a thousand lonely, angry ladies.

Sometimes, I wish I could line up all the idiots in one line, pull a trigger and put a bullet in all their heads. OMMs would be on that line. If you want to take a look at all the things that have been frowned upon in the world and become a norm, and reverse it. Lets see what that would entail…

1. Keeping women in the kitchen.
2. Letting them speak outloud.
3. Letting them work outside the home. (Which ironically is responsible for the downfall of the 1960′s image of the family unit. Dad works, kids come home do sports mom stays at home typa deal. Soo infact women destroyed the view of the family unit first before homosexuality ever did.)
4. Rights for women to marry who they want.

And yes, I consider homosexuality a norm, just like women in the work place, and doing what they want. I’ve grown up knowing gay people just as much as straight or bi. I’m use to it, and so is my generation (minus the stupid single minded idiots who where brainwashed since out of the womb). And you know what OMMs in 20 years you’ll be dead and none of your opinions will matter. So if you see this read it, and know with every bit of hate in my heart, I hate people like you. You destroyed the white picket fence theory not the gays.

The Boy With A Herve Villechaize Tattoo

May 24, 2012 at 4:22 pm

So, according to the One Million Moms and their ideas on how much comic books influence children, when I was a kid reading the Marvel Avengers comics, I wanted to grow up to be like a favorite character of mine, Dr. Henry Pym/Ant-Man/Yellowjacket.
According to their ideals, I was so into the character that I wanted to emulate his very actions.
I was so influenced by Pym that I eventually grew up to fall in love with a woman then angrily beat the crap out of her, because that’s what Pym did?
Really?!?
First off, yes while kids aren’t the prime demographic for comics anymore, they need to give children some credit.
Kids aren’t the mindless little sponges that will absorb anything and everything with reckless abandon.
Children are smarter than that these days, and only getting smarter as time wears on.
They ARE like sponges waiting to absorb, but they are intuitive and have thoughts, feelings, conceptions, and varying levels of understanding. Something the OMM don’t seem to have a clue on, that understanding part.
Also, I’m sure Marvel and DC would LOVE to thank them for the free publicity. As if they didn’t already need more of it after their all too recent announcements, they just got a buttload of publicity, thanks to the OMM.

Word of advice, OMM:
IF you want to keep people from reading these comics, you should just use reverse psychology and be all for the new Marvel and DC homosexuality stuff. See, people don’t take you ladies (not even 1 million of you, actually, so that’s a misnomer right off the bat) seriously when you shout your intolerant disgust to the high heavens in the name of God and Christianity.
Have you learned nothing from the PMRC and their crusade against the music business in the 1980s?
They got so far as to slap warning labels on albums they deemed to have Explicit Content.
Guess what happened. That’s right!
The albums sold way more than they initially would have in the first place.

Face it ladies, you just pumped up Marvel and DC’s sales by default.
NICE JOB! ;)

about 20 years ago I read the issue of Alpha Flight where Northstar came out of the closet, when I was a young teenager.
Didn’t turn me gay. Anyone get turned gay by that? Anyone?
(It was a pretty good story though)

A Comic Book Fan

May 24, 2012 at 4:24 pm

Note: This is not in defense of Million Moms.

Why do we fight hate with hate? Talking about wanting all of the members of this group dead, what does that accomplish? They may be misinformed or acting out of their religious beliefs, but talking about wanting them dead, how is that any more right than what they are doing?

Think of this as teaching moment, not an, “Oh yeah, SUCK IT!” in response type -o- thing.

Anonymous

May 24, 2012 at 3:04 pm

These people do realize there are several conclusive scientific studies that show that being gay is not a choice, right? You can’t pray out the gay, same as reading gay superheroes won’t “turn” you gay. You are either born gay or you are not, which makes me ask the question – why does God make something a sin that he has placed out of your control? Why are gay couples, according to the Catholic Church, not allowed to partake in the physical act of lovemaking (they have stated it is okay to be gay though) other wise it is a sin, when essentially it was God that made partners of the opposite sex biologically unsuitable to them? Maybe the Million Moms should answer those questions before they but their nose into comics where they don’t belong.

I totally agree with you on this. I am a gay christian who DID NOT choose to be this way. Why would a normal person up and decide one day that they want to be with another man or woman? NO ONE!! And YES the Bible says this is wrong and I agree, but when you can’t help but be who you are, knowing that you arent attracted to the opposite sex, yet people condemn you and say evil, cruel things about you and driving young children to suicide…this is taking things to a whole new level. My God does not say bully those who are different until they end their lives, nor does it say to hate anyone who is gay or different in ANY such way. God says to LOVE EVERYONE. White, black, straight, gay, healthy, sick. Those who condemn others are doomed to be condemned when the Judgement Day comes. This is one of Gods commandments: love thy neighbor. Not one time in the Bible does it say for someone to judge another person. That is NOT your job, that is God’s job. Just saying. If every so called “christian” would stop and actually THINK about what the Bible says and what God commands that they do, the world would be a much better place. If your child is gay, it’s not because they chose that life or because of a comic book (I mean REALLY???). Don’t try to blame movies or music or comic books because it makes you look stupid for one, and for two, this makes all of you “homophobes” no better than Hitler when he condemned and killed the Jews. Or even Bin Laden when he tried to destroy America…you know, LAND OF THE FREE!!! And who are Gods chosen people? The Jews. I know my Bible and the word HATE is not part of it. And if you all can stand by and justify any of your actions, comments, hate and cruelty, than I think you need to stop reading your “satanic bible” and start reading the Holy Bible. This is life people. Teach your children that being gay is wrong, but don’t hate them because they are gay nor use a comic event or characters sexuality to condemn anyone or try to justify to yourselves that this is why your child is gay. If you dont want them reading the comic because of this, then STOP them from reading comic books anymore. You are the parent, they are the child. It’s not rocket science people. I just pray God has as much “mercy” on everyone one of you that you all seem to have on those who are different.

OMM is such a great source of comedy.

Stolen from Cracked.com…

“One Million Moms is a website based on intolerance and the inability to count. It’s named the same way a kid might call himself Commander Badass Boobtoucher: desperate wish-fulfillment and blatant lies. Despite being an entirely online group, they only had about 40,000 Facebook fans, an accurate count both of their real support and of how many moms don’t know their kids have already blocked them. By their math, I could call my dick the Pleaser of Luxembourg and it would be more accurate, because I’m only short about half a million people.”

Read more: How Archie’s Gay Friend Proved the Internet Can Do Good | Cracked.com http://www.cracked.com/blog/how-archies-gay-friend-proved-internet-can-do-good/#ixzz1vphsEWIZ

@ Anonymous
May 24, 2012 at 4:00 pm

Specifically: “There was another study that measured blood to… certain areas that would be too lewd to mention on such a reputable site. They took gay, straight and bisexual men and measured their involuntary response to certain pornographic images, and then were shown nonsexual images to, how do I say this, “cleanse the palette” before showing them the next one. What they found was that straight men were turned on only by what was deemed straight porn, gay men were turned on only by the gay porn, and interestingly, not a single bi-sexual man was turned on by both types of images (which is a whole different can of worms irrelevant to this conversation).”

This study is not one you should ever cite. You know they dismissed over a third of participants as anomalies? A third is more than an anomaly. Most were men who identified as bisexual. The people conducting that study had an agenda, and twisted their results to match that agenda.

@ EG
It really doesn’t disprove it. These were involuntary responses. You can’t stop a biological reaction to stimuli by saying “I’ve decided I won’t respond to that anymore.” This is brain chemistry we are talking about here, it’s why they’ve developed pills for depression instead of sticking with the old method of yelling, “Buck up, cowboy! The real world isn’t fair, so get over it!” Not that I am in any way saying being gay is a mental disorder we need to cure with pills. That would be wrong, and I think the X-Men Northstar is a a member of have actually explored that area several times to good effect.

You know that test the doctor does with you knee to check reflexes? The responses in the study are basically the same. You are trying to make the argument that, metaphorically, people have a light switch they can flip when it comes to sexual orientation, which is about as realistic as saying if I were lactose intolerant (straight), that if I choose to be lactose tolerant (gay), my body will respond accordingly. Try that, see what happens. The notion is ludicrous.

@ Peter Kelly
Scott Lobdell on average tends to be a very good writer on average I think, when his ideas aren’t being blown up into company wide cross-overs to clear the deck for Image reboots of Marvel’s super-heroes like in the case of Onslaught (a great villain who was used very poorly because of reasons I don’t want to go into).

@Anonymous

Have a look at Cat’s comment.

I find it amusing when these articles are posted on here. As if there would be any type of actual discussion, and not just a ton of like minded-people bashing another group of like-minded people.

The one thing that is sad is that people use the term conservative and liberal for matters like this. I am a conservative (less government and choices for me and less government getting involved). My stance is that if 2 consenting people want to make each other happy and don’t infringe on my right to be happy go have fun whatever it is. My half brother was about to come out of the closet and announce to everyone that he was gay. My side of the family was perfectly happy and fine with it he had nice friends and they really seemed to care about him. His father couldn’t handle it and was opposed to it completely. Since he didn’t have the love or approval from his father he went into a depressed emotional talespin which he ended up taking his own life. It is that kind of intolerance that not only destroys lives but hurts entire families so please everyone should just think before we act out.

wardencommander

May 24, 2012 at 4:43 pm

As a gay man myself, it brings me a small measure of peace to know that just a hundred years ago, none of those ‘One Million Moms’ had the right to vote, let alone speak out like this. A hundred years, and now women are one of if not the single biggest demographic that advertisers, politicians, ect. all target. It may suck that we have to fight for basic human rights against religious persecution in a country that was founded to prevent just that. But in a hundred years, with any luck, the ‘One Million Moms’ gay great grandchildren won’t even know what this persecution is about. That’s the thing I love about the USA so much; we aren’t perfect. We don’t have everything right. But change is coming. Change is constantly coming and we are constantly, as a nation, making baby steps to reach that perfect union where all men and women, regardless of race, sexual orientation, religious views, whatever they case may be, can be protected and thrive. At the end of the day, that’s what makes all of this worth it.

LMAO! Marvel and DC WISH each child of a million mothers were reading their books….

@ Cat
See, I did not know that. I will remember that in the future. The other one still stands though!

@ EG
I pointed out two studies, and the part that disproved one of the studies was something irrelevant to the argument. I wasn’t talking about bisexual men. I was talking about gay men choosing what they were turned on by. However, disregard the study anyways, fruit from the forbidden tree and all that. I still have another study that has that stands.

Some commented that these moms are on their rights to express their opinion. Fair enough. But they don’t have the right to try and intimidate DC and Marvel through tons of emails to not publish the comics. Let’s stop mistaking “freedom of expression” with censorship. Because if the brillant moms think they have the right to stop the publications, I´m on my right to found the One Million Atheists and send thousands and thousands of emails to the Vatican and many other publishers to stop selling the bible. With so many major real problems worldwide, this is absolutely stupid and idiotic.

They sound like lazy parents in all honesty…’Someone police entertainment so we don’t have to stop watching Paula Dean and actually do some parenting!’. Should be fun when some of these children come out of the closet, not for the kids, but to see one million little ill-informed, backwards thinking worldviews come crashing down. Live and let live for goodness sake. Do you really think this is the kind of living Jesus was selling, you uptight prudish bigoted old biddies?

I’ve always felt the “Born this way” vs choice argument was a bad and irreverent one. It implies two things:

1: That if Homosexuality were completely a choice, then it would be okay to condemn and punish someone for sexual and romantic behavior in their private life that does not hurt anyone else.

2: If Homosexuality must be accepted simply because people can’t choose not to be that way, then that would also apply if, say, pedophilia was found to have a similar cause.

Can someone with an ingrained sexual orientation choose not to act on it at all? Sure. But in the case of Homosexuality, why should they? Is there any hard science that shows that two consenting adults of the same gender having a relationship hurts anyone? Can allowing them to marry be shown to actually cause any real harm to others or society in general? Do you really think forcing them to be alone and miserable, or into a loveless relationship with someone of the opposite sex would actually make them a more contributing member to society?

The only real agreement against it comes from religion. If you believe that it is wrong for religious reasons, then you are free to not live your own life that way. However, until you can back up the danger or immorality of it with hard proof, you don’t have the right to force it onto others who may not share your beliefs.

Allowing them to live their lives the way they choose would benefit them in having a richer and more productive life with no discernible drawbacks. Compare that to a pedophile, for whom allowing them to indulge in their desires would have a major negative impact on others.

Marvel is doing a variant cover for Astonishing 51. Doesn’t that tell you something about their true motivation for this??..

You all sound like hypocrites to me. Defending what you belive in and your opinions yet bashing other peoples beliefs and morals and values? Makes me laugh. Personally, i think that this move of putting gay characters in comic books is horrible. Disgusting actually. Why? Because of what i belive and know to be true. That God did not intend marriage to be this way. He created marriage to be between a man and a woman only. And the fact that it has been twisted is a real tragedy. But that doesnt mean i hate the people. I love gay people. I have a few friends that are gay. I love the people AS people but i hate the sin.

Of all the bull@#$% coming out of peoples mouths, now there is this load of crap coming from a bunch of lame, sorry, pathetic “so-called moms”(who probably shouldn’t try parenting, EPIC FAIL THERE!!!) trying to pass THEIR conservative views on everyone else. I am a straight white male who believes in a live and let live way of life. I don’t care about who is/isn’t gay, whether there black, white, hispanic, alien(E.T.). What you as a gay or lesbian do with your lives is none of my business. AT ALL!!! It is so pathetic to live in the greatest country in the world where our diversity is what makes us so strong, yet, you have these idiots creating more bull@#$% to drive a wedge deeper between us all so they can get what they want. Just because you don’t like something about someone doesn’t mean you have ANY right to change them to suit you. Hell, I don’t like the crap your spewing out of your potholes, does that mean I get to remove your vocal chords? Unfortunately no I don’t get to do that!!!

Such an ridiculous argument deserves an equally ridiculous response: http://raheemfh.tumblr.com/post/23693381605/milf-moms-id-like-to-forget

The only time I see “kids’ and “Moms” in comic book stores is on Free Comic Book Day….when a million mom’s are dragging 7 or 8 kids through several stores, ordering them to take one of EVERYTHING. They’d never spend a DIME in a store, would never come in if stuff weren’t free….and half the time the “kids” are complaining that they “don’t even like comics”.

Let’s be honest. Has any child anywhere ever actually said the words “I want to be like Northstar”? How many children do these people think even know who Northstar is?

How has nobody mentioned Catholic Priests yet? C’mon!

PS – if you take the Bible to be 100% literal, then it’s okay to sell your daughter into slavery, beat your child to death if he or she doesn’t listen to your warnings (so he or she doesn’t grow up to become a sinner), yadda, yadda, yadda. Thinking of the Bible as an historical account is missing the point of the Bible. A collection of [dated] moral allegories.

Christians ate always worried about other people and 9 out of 10 times they are raging hypocrites. God is no more real than the Green Lantern Corp or the Jedi. Wake up and just admit you are prejudice losers who want power to control others. Homosexuality is natural and no more a sin than masturbating. Every animal in the animal kingdom has homosexual members. And even if God was real- he supposedly created man in his image so we are all his children. Who are you to judge? Shut up and let him deal with it. He is the only boss.

Stupidity should be a sin.

Anytime these idiots do anything, I support whatever they are rallying against. I wasn’t even planning on buying any of these books, now I’m going to buy two. Just like I did with Archie.

I’d rather protest the unabashed greed of both companies than this … I mean seriously, Archie comics has a gay wedding and they didn’t go out of business and half a year later Marvel and DC decide to follow already seriously tread roads (does anyone even remember Rainmaker from Gen 13, having a gay character then was gutsy)tell me it isn’t just for money.

I want a character who is a superhero who kicks ass and happens to be gay, not a character who’s a gay superhero. Who the devil is Northstar anyway? Seriously. And whoever DC makes gay this time around whose to say they won’t undo it the next time a crisis looms …

>> As a gay man myself, it brings me a small measure of peace to know that just a hundred years ago, none of those ‘One Million Moms’ had the right to vote, let alone speak out like this.>>

Actually, they did. Because not only aren’t there a million of ‘em, they’re largely not moms, either. Every part of their name is a lie.

They’re an offshoot of the American Family Association, and their board is mostly male.

So they’re mostly men pretending to be women (pretending to be a very large number of women at once, in fact), concerned about other people’s gender issues.

Deleware Smith

May 24, 2012 at 5:51 pm

Reading these comments – its mind blowing to say the least and shows the mindset of a lot of people in America. Things are changing…as a people we are evolving and society is slowly, and I mean that literally, is catching up with the times.

Those 1MM’s have their right to have their opinion heard…but as many have said, I’m sure many of their children don’t even read comics and I’m sure they all didn’t boycot comic stores when Northstar intially came out. So, why now? “Gay” is the new thing to exploit and push and have rolled in the media. To have a “soundbite” that lasts as long as me typing this comment. Who FLIPPIN’ cares!?

You don’t want your child reading about two guys getting married – don’t buy the book. PERIOD! That’s how you get your point across to the publisher. But don’t tell me, as an adult, what I can or can’t read. But that’s not the issue…

And when it comes to the “bible” its amazing how the OLD TESTIMENT is always being referenced to explain one’s feeling or push one’s agenda…when even God moved on and is a merciful God and forgives us for our sins. For those that believe that “homosexuality” is NOT a choice…that’s your opinion. But its in you…and you can act like it doesn’t exist…but you are who you are. That’s why we have thoses that are dyfunctional in one aspect or completely over the top in the other… Its a “natual” thing…for its in the animal kingdome (watch the Animal Channel or read about it)…so, you can keep thinking its NOT a choice all you want.

But I digress…

Tomorrow…most of you won’t even care about two guys geting married and neither will those 1MM. The story was meant to be a celebration of two poeple wanting to have the same rights that so many toss off like used toilet paper.

So, 1MMs – keep preachinhg hatred and ignorance….that’s your choice. That’s your right. At the end of the day…those characters won’t change…the publishers will continue to publish stories that will have these gay characters in them (they won’t be the focus of the story…but they’ll be there)…

It is…what it sadly is.

Sweet jesus, these complainers need to get lives.

Christopher G

May 24, 2012 at 5:59 pm

Wow! I don’t understand how people can be Christian unless someone is gay. The bible also forbids women from speaking in church (1 Corinthians 14:34-35) or getting a rounded haircut (Leviticus 19:27) or getting remarried after a divorce (Mark 10:11-12 ). I’m not clear why somethings in the bible are ignored while others are not.

Their concern is that children look up to comic book characters as role models, which I certainly understand, but I don’t see children growing up and turning into mutants or aliens either. So I’m fairly sure that if they read a comic with a gay character they aren’t going to suddenly turn gay. But I’ve been wrong before…

They do realize that there are already at least one openly lesbian comic right? I mean the new Batwoman really didn’t hide the lesbian activity there!!!!! So its alright to show some lesbians kissing but have two guys smooching on the cover and getting married and that’s bad! These people just really don’t get it do they.

Crimson Torpedo

May 24, 2012 at 6:05 pm

“Children mimic superhero actions and even dress up in costumes to resemble these characters as much as possible. Can you imagine little boys saying, ‘I want a boyfriend or husband like X-Men?’ This is ridiculous! Why do adult gay men need comic superheroes as role models? They don’t but do want to indoctrate [sic] impressionable young minds by placing these gay characters on pedestals in a positive light.”
~~~
Yea, well, guess what Million Moms, they mimic more than just superheroes. Let’s see you go after television, movies and music that their kids watch and listen to that glorifies thug/gansta violence. It’s certainly okay to portray this “lifestyle” in every medium possible where teenagers are portrayed as cool because the carry guns and shoot everybody in sight, but show two loving people expressing their emotions for each other and suddenly it’s indoctrination, recruiting and brainwashing.

These “extreme” Christians give the rest of us Christians a bad name. I wish they’d just stop already. Jesus said that we were to be accepting of everyone. He himself was associated with what was considered the lower class people during his life. Remember “Let Him Who is Without Sin Cast the First Stone” or “Judge Not Lest Ye Be Judged”. No one is free from sin, and you should be working on yourselves rather than pointing the finger at others.

Prophet Guard

May 24, 2012 at 6:21 pm

After 60 years, it’s another Seduction of the Innocent waiting to happen.

Forget Avengers VS X-Men or those gay characters, I think I’d actually want to read a comic called Comic Fans VS One Million Moms. Maybe the fights would be better.

The irony is…”One Million Moms” is actually less than 40,000 moms, and all they did to join was click “Like” on Facebook.

So they are liars to begin with – great lesson to their own kids, who they should pay attention to instead of worrying about everyone else’s.

I’m fine with One Million Mom’s being against homosexuality. I’m even fine with them disliking the comic as it does not represent their moral code. I’m NOT fine with them deciding that because they don’t like it, I don’t get to choose for myself whether or not to buy it. Why do their decisions outweight my own? They feel Marvel is pushing homosexuality at them and their children. I feel they are pushing hate and intolerance at me and my children. With that said, I fully support their right to petition Marvel. It’s their free speech at stake. I have the right to contact Marvel myself and tell them how I feel. But these arguments always come down to one simple solution: if you don’t like it . . . don’t buy it. Don’t let your children buy it. Refuse to buy it for them, but don’t refuse me the right to buy it for myself or my children. And bible references never help. Romans 1 says homosexuality is wrong? Okay. Leviticus 25:44 condones the buying of male and female slaves. Why aren’t they protesting the 13th amendment?

Solution: Don’t buy your kids the comics.

Um…A) Northstar, Hulkling, Wiccan, and others have been gay for quite a while. B) Kids will know what being homosexual is from reading the comic, and won’t be grown into an anti-gay hate group. C) Yes, it was part of the Bible, but that passage in Romans wasn’t written by any of the major gospel writers, and represents what ONE MAN thought, not Jesus himself. And D) Being gay was COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE IN NEARLY EVERYONE’S EYES 1500-ish years ago, when that passage was written. Not exactly the best place to draw your beliefs on sexual orientation from.

yeah. If they couldn’t get Archie to cave in to their ludicrous demands, what hope do they have of getting the Big Two to do it?

Moment of reflection, at 3% of the population One Million Moms would have at least 30,000 gay children.

Kurt Busiek’s tweets are spot on: “Kids need to learn, marriage can’t be between two men. It can only be one man and another man pretending to be lots of women.”.

I understand that people think being gay is a sin, and I say whatever, its their belief and their right. You want to not buy a comic because the characters are gay, again fine. But to try and stop this from happening is just dumb. The real sin is trying to force a point of view on the rest of us.

And another thing, Marvel and DC are not trying to promote homosexuality, they are trying to prompt tolerance and understanding. Having gay characters shows the kids (lets pretend they are still reading comics for this argument) that its ok to be gay. Gay people are not different then us, so you dont have to hate them.

One Mil Moms is probably one woman with 30 cats and a laptop.

Katie Murphy - ex catholic family

May 24, 2012 at 7:23 pm

One million moms is about a few thosuand bigots of the same style that justified slavery as per the bible

Re the comment “People should quote scripture in press releases more often. It’s REALLY persuasive.”

Answer – Scripture is simply living in the dark ages of ignorance and superstion, mixed with hatred over the centuries of gays, Jews, Asians, blacks etc etc

I also noted someone saying, correctly – “one million moms makes me sorry I am a xtian” That scorrect , but there are lots of good xtian religiouns that accept gays and more and more of them are even doing gay religious marriages.

We’ve come a long ways. In general, most kids know gay kids and know nothing is wrong with being gay.\

As for the bigots, they will go to their grave dishonored, unsung and disgraced, and seen as the often white trash they are.

Howdy all,

Just started a group on Facebook to demonstrate our strength of numbers to the One Million (SIC) Moms, but more importantly to show the companies we won’t stand for censorship from outside meddling moralists who haven’t picked up a comic book since 1955.

Feel free to join and spread the word around.

Oops the link didn’t post like I thought it would

https://www.facebook.com/groups/269307163166721/

There we go.

Cheers!
RC

“DC Comics and Marvel are using superheroes to confuse them on this topic to raise questions and awareness of an alternative lifestyle choice”

Sorry, but that what children do: They make innapropiate questions, about everything.
Is their right to make adults feel unconfortable about the rules and the whys of life and society. And don’t blindy accept those rules.

Speaking as somebody in marketing, my dream would be to have One Million Moms protest against any product I’m launching. What better way to ensure your product flies off the shelves! I wonder if they’re open to promotional opportunities…! :)

@ E.G.

Not sure about it being absolute, but I found this to be insightful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVwjCppq82c

I’m impressed that the majority of the posts on here seem to be pro-diversity and anti-OMM intolerance.

Quite a nice change from reading any story on MSN.com with the word “gay” in it. The hateful viscious holier-than-thous have a field day on there. And I love it when they complain that when we complain about the intolerance then we are being intolerant of their views… well, their views are directly attacking me and many very loving and wonderful people I know and millions of people that they don’t know, so yeah, I do not have much tolerance for that.

I grew up baptist in Texas and from the moment I realized I was attracted to guys I felt shame and self-hatred due to my religious beliefs and the ridicule of “fags” which was the ONLY exposure I had to anything gay. I went between bouts of thoughts of suicide and praying constantly for god to make me straight. I was 25 when I finally accepted who I am. Gay is NOT a choice. I fought it as hard as a person can fight other than suicide. I almost cannot blame straight people for thinking it may be a choice because they have not had to struggle with it themselves, but at least open your ignorant eyes to the idea that you may just not know rather than condemning every gay person.

Props to Marvel for being bold and supportive of ALL people.One Million Moms can kick rocks!

And to be fair, saying that the OMM should be lined up and shot is no better than saying gays should all be shipped to an island to die of AIDS. Speaking out against intolerance is one thing but wishing harm or death on people makes you no better than them.

C Fox, not one study? I found several but here is one, because that is how many you say do not exist:
http://escholarship.org/uc/item/863841tx#page-2

Oh, what the heck, here are some more:
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/261/5119/321
http://www.nature.com/ng/journal/v11/n3/abs/ng1195-248.html
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/226963.php

You may chose not to believe them, many people ignore evidence that flies in the face of their beliefs, but to say there are no such studies is either an outright lie or a statement made from ignorance.

Wow….as a guy who doesn’t even support gay marriage, just…….ugghhhh

And to be fair, saying that the OMM should be lined up and shot is no better than saying gays should all be shipped to an island to die of AIDS.

What about lining them up and and laughing my ass off at them? Seems more appropriate….

Who Cares N. E. Way

May 24, 2012 at 8:16 pm

Um….Christians, Buddhists, and other people who have no religious convictions do read and collect comics folks. Even some conservatives read them. Shocking—I know. It’s not the small little world of only one demographic that buys them there funny books. Amazing. You thought only folks just like you liked to read Spider-man? Seriously?

If gays and liberals were the only folks who liked superheroes…..the industry wouldnt just be floundering. it would be dead. The same way it would be if only Conservatives or Christians bought them. I can understand the gripes of both sides. One side wants gay heroes, because they don’t care about the others view that it’s a “sin”. Other sides think it is offensive because of their doctrines. But lets face it…..it takes everyone in all kinds of groups buying a product to keep it in existence.I doubt one single demographic brought the Avengers film into the over a billion dollars mark. I couldnt care less about Northstar getting married. If you find it offensive: speak with your dollars. Give the money to the new issue of The Shadow from Dynamite. You can watch him waste Nazis 2000 feet above the earth. Because hey—everyone hates Nazis…right?

So— folks should just stop insulting everyone whose opinion doesnt mirror their own. If someone only “tolerates” the fact that there are people whose beliefs differ from theirs, and dont embrace those ideas, they are in a “hate group” now? I thought tolerance for all ideas and respect for all opinions was the mantra for g/l/tg groups just a few years back. But now it has to be a singular way of seeing things or the highway?

If you believe what your religion teaches you, why must you be a bigot? Religious people have friends and family who arent carbon copies of them. They arent all out to burn a cross in someone’s yard. Realize this~ people who are devout believe their respective tomes that they live their lives by to be written by the hand of The Almighty. You can call them names like bigot, hater, homophobe and the like—but in doing so, you make them feel as if they are being persecuted for their respective gospels sake, and worse…you become what you supposedly hate more than anything…. A BULLY.

When was the last time an announcement was made like: Marvel introduces a new Jewish superhero? Marvel introduces a new Christian Hero? Marvel introduces a new Muslim, Buddhist, Asian, Black, Hispanic, Latino or …..? Hero? Pretty much never. I think Thing is the only Jewish Marvel hero besides Sabra I can even think of. I think Daredevil is a Catholic. But you sure dont see many heroes espousing their faiths in funy books. Personally—I think sex in comics is the stupidest thing in the world. I couldnt care less about imagining cartoon characters getting it on.

Takes all kinds to make a world…..even the folks whose views are completely anathema to us. Thats life.

People of faith arent going to just slap themselves in the head and go “Oh–I could’ve had a v-8″ because you try to make them see things your way. If it comes down to being called names for the sake of the Bible, Talmud, Torah, Koran or whatever….they will take the “word of God” over the “word of men” any day.
You cannot preach inclusiveness, diversity and anti bullying, and then because someone has a differing opinion, engage in such behaviours. That makes you a hypocrite. People of any walk of like will notice that.

OMM are pathetic..I’m a Christian and believe what the Bibles says to be 100% the truth and I hate homosexuality but not homosexuals(although I’m guessing that still makes me a homophobe right?). I don’t like this group doing this. Who are you going to be selective about this one issue? Plenty of other “sins” that go on in comics but they never protest those do they? Just shows how bigoted they really are and truely out of the touch they are about what Jesus taught in how to treat others and trying to bring to salvations. Love the sinner, hate the sin.

All of you who may lean to the left on here may think I’m intolerant or that all of the OMM are but I’ve quickly discovered over the last five years that the ones who are always preaching tolerance tend to always be the most intolerant. Wishing bads things for these people is going over the line. If they wanted all homosexuals to die and be beaten to a bloody pump then yeah you could say that. Hoping they get shot or die is far more worse then this pathetic group.

One Million Moms, you’ve just inspired me to make a donation to the local chapter of PFLAG, in your honor. Thank you so much for enticing me to give charitably. :-)

As the owner of Dragon Quills, THE comic shop in Gadsden, Alabama, I have made sure to triple my order on ASTONISHING x-MEN 51.

That said, they are more than welcome to buy up as many copies that they want after subscribers.

But, there is no way that anyone in the industry should stand back and be bullied by these theocratic, homophobic bigots

Any comic shop owner should follow your practices, Blake. ;-) Love it.

I love how so many barely educated mouth beathers somehow know was does and does not offense a fictional deity.

They need to get this into their head, the majority of us straight population don’t care. People can be happy and do what they want as long as they don’t hurt others. I don’t see anyone offending me in any way, I see happy normal people living their lives.

They should call themselves O.M.M.U.M. … One Million Messed Up Moms.

Tell those moms to go suck one million eggs! lol

@jason Agreed 100%

What….. Gay people in comics is a new thing for DC/Marvel?!? I know DC has had Terry Berg (Kyle Rayner’s assistant in GL) back in the 90′s, as well as the Tasmanian Devil was gay as well… There was also Obsidian who came out of the closet within the last 10 years or so… And let’s not forget both Batwoman and Ice Maiden (Sigrid Nansen) who both prefer the company of women……….. And those are just the characters I can think of within a minute!!

The problem with this protest is kids don’t read comic books anymore. I haven’t seen a kid in my comic shop
since ’95. How are they protected kids? They should get their kids to stop playing video games and surfing the
internet all the time. They should take some cooking lessons so their kids can eat a real meal instead of the
crap that they are feeding them.

What kid would want to be Northstar? Regardless of who he’s attracted to, he’s usually been kind of a dick.

Craig DeBoard

May 24, 2012 at 10:50 pm

I’m not sure which is sadder. That fact that One Million Moms says this garbage or that someone told these one million people that they were allowed to breed.

if i was Marvel or DC, this’d just make me more inclined to have characters, just to twist these buttwipes’ tails.

gay. that should’ve said “have gay characters”… (too damn early…)

Silly Moms should realize that kids no longer read comics.

I am a straight Male, Who grew up in a family of straight people. My Mom is Homophobic, but Her ideals has not influenced me in the least.

I believe that What a comic Book company wants to do is their own decision, and by OMM Bashing it and saying its immoral, will only fuel the fire for those who want to read it as well as the company, Just because they got so much limelight for this one issue, they are going to keep doing it.

Now as per my own opinion, I believe this doesn’t really matter, who REALLY Cares that they are making super heroes gay, If their making a fuss about this, then why hasnt GTA been boycotted for its constant dealing with murders, sexual intercourse, drugs and so on.

Why Hasnt several tv Shows been boycotted and removed from tv, for the same thing, I can think of a few shows (Two and a Half Men, Family Guy, SIMPSONS,) where the episode is based around being homosexual.

The Movie Brokeback Mountain is another example.

WHY just this comic book and the Archie one are they making a big fuss over?
I think OMM is just a pain in the ass, who chooses what topics, and when they fight.
IMO, they should be working, to find cures for diseases, helping to get homeless people off the streets, donating their time to reputable charities, instead of wasting it fighting about something that many kids/teens/adults already know about and have pretty much learned to accept (Well minus these OMM Buffoons)

I believe everyone needs a “Superhero” they can look up to, and tell me whats worse on the cover of a comic book?
A) A girl or Guy being chained up and sexually abused?
B) Two people (regardless of gender) actually embracing their love and happiness?

People Need to realise we live in 2012, NOT 1812…
The world has grown and changed.

If you don’t like something or don’t want your kids to watch/read/see it…
THEN. DONT. WATCH/READ/SEE. IT. OR. LET. THEM. WATCH/READ/SEE. IT.

Your the Parent. Their The Kid. Simple As that.

BTW, OMM reminds me of the episode of the Simpsons, where Kent Brockman says a swear on TV, and Ned Goes crazy and goes online and starts complaining about it.

Rod Flanders: What are you doing, daddy?
Ned Flanders: Imploring some people I never met to pressure a government with better things to do to punish an innocent man for doing something that nobody saw. That’s what I’m doing!
Rod Flanders: Daddy, we think you need a new mommy.
Ned Flanders: First things first.

Enough Said…

First the facts. One Million Moms is a “nonprofit organization” that consists mostly of women aged 30-44 and have less than 50,000 members. Most of their posts, according to their Facebook site http://www.facebook.com/onemillionmoms , most of their posts come from Chicago. They are typical of American Christian groups who pick and choose bible quotes to justify their self-appointed moral causes to blame society for what they fail to personal achieve as good people. They have attempted to boycott JCPenny for hiring Ellen Degeneres as their spokesperson, attempted to boycott Toys R Us for displaying an Archie comic displaying a gay wedding, and are now attempting to boycott DC and Marvel for similar reasons.

Groups that use the book of Leviticus to justify their anti-gay statements and actions, choose to ignore much of everything else in Leviticus. They will counter-argue that the Old Testament is mosaic code (for the Jewish people) but they still cling to Leviticus 18:22 and 20:13. One states that the homosexual act is an “abomination” and the latter states that if they commit these acts then they will be killed. Clinging to those two verses in Leviticus while ignoring all other verses is hypocritical. Not only do they (hypocritical Christians) choose to ignore every other do and don’t in Leviticus, they also choose to ignore the fact that Jesus Christ had nothing to say about homosexuality. It can be logically assumed that if Jesus had no say in something that he neither approved nor disapproved of it. He did cover many matters of importance during his short life span.

The OMM post discusses Romans 1:26-27 but it’s an out-of-context quote. Paul came to Corinth and described scenes of how Roman men and women, who were heterosexuals, were engaging in sexual acts akin to idol worshipping and not because they themselves were homosexual. Paul’s issue wasn’t that they were committing homosexual acts, it was that they were prostituting themselves for the love of money and statues. Also, notice that it is Paul’s writings that mention this scene whereas Jesus never bothered with this stuff.

I have noticed a few angry comments attacking Christians in these posts and I want to make something very clear. Do not preach hatred and intolerance simply because a vocal minority says something offensive to you. I am clearly offended by OMM just as 99% of you here are too. But I am a Christian and I hope that by reading my comments, you see that I use logic and am tolerant of others. I simply do not care if the LGBT community were genetically born that way or they chose that lifestyle because I am going to decide how to treat them based on their character and not on their sexual orientation. There are a silent majority of logical, tolerant Christians in America who choose to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ and prefer to stay away from denying other people’s rights to happiness.

“change and cancel all plans of homosexual superhero characters immediately. Ask them to do the right thing and reverse their decision to have sexual orientation displayed to readers.”

“…reverse their decision to have sexual orientation displayed to readers.”

So… I hope this organization realizes that means no heterosexuality either. ‘Cause you know, that’s a sexual orientation. So they want marvel to split up all the couples and have everyone be asexual. No more Reed and Sue, and I guess we’ll erase the kids from the timeline. *rolls eyes*

Really though, I am going to pick this issue up, it’s great to see LGBT representation in comics.

Sadly there are many small minded people among “fans”. Just look at the comments below AXM #50 cover Marvel posted on their facebook page. This is beyond words: http://www.facebook.com/Marvel/posts/10150905998727488

Marvel and DC characters have already killed, lied, cheated, stolen and so forth for years, yet this group has not complained about any of those issues. Nothing Northstar does will make your son stop liking boobies if that’s what they like.

What kind of crazed mindset do they have? Do they think straight guys who listen to Queen once or catch a glimpse of Neil Patrick Harris on TV suddenly think women are barf inducing?

Judge Fred MANSON

May 25, 2012 at 2:14 am

“Are you Mum enough?”

Thanks to these bigots to freely promote these two titles!!! In this era of financial crisis, it is good to have such huge commercials for free!!!

Bets are opened: how many issues will be sold for each title? :)

Isn’t Christianity about tolerance didn’t Jesus say ‘love one another as I have loved you’ did I miss the ‘except the gays’ part of the. Message, these people spread so much hate it’s unchristian. Im gonna buy 2 copies just to further pee these people off!

So, they are ok with superheros putting on lycra, wearing underpants on the outside of trousers…they are ok with a man putting on a robotic suit but also having it up with the girls… xmen hero who has knives come out his hands and kill people… must i go on!!!
The majority of kids who actually read these comics are old enough – if they are not, then parents are probably buying the comic… and even if they dont learn about it in a comic they will in real life.
If i had a child, i would want to bring them up to except people for who they are, for them to do their best in life and to help anyone and everyone – i certainly would not be trying to blind them…
There have been many books, movies, TV shows with gay character and i have never seen a kid try to reenact a gay character unless it was for a joke or they were gay….
this really goes to show how stupid some people in america really are – maybe they should focus on their own life and stop trying to spoil the life for others!

@Who Cares N. E. Way- You made a lot of excellent points. Kudos. The one thing that is constant about these type of discussions is whenever you say you don’t agree with someone’s lifestyle, people automatically think it means you hate and condemn them. I don’t hate anyone…that goes against me being Christian in itself.

You can love someone but not agree with how they choose to live their life. Heck, I don’t like how some of my family is living their lives right now and I often disappoint myself with how I act sometimes…the only thing I can do is pray about it. For those who think/feel prayer isn’t powerful…I encourage you not to give it up. Keep that lifeline to the Lord open. God loves us all… that is definitely true and don’t let anyone tell you different but He has called us to live a better life than the ones we want for ourselves.

I posted on this board earlier only saying that everyone has an opinion and a right to that opinion… as we can clearly see. Everybody doesn’t have good intentions when they say certain things. There are MANY folks who talk Christianity but have hate in their heart. I’m sincere, hard to tell because you don’t know me and it’s over the internet. But I’m sincere in what I’m saying. God Bless everyone

P.S. Despite many elements, I love comics too.

I mean who cares about this really?

After all if it does turn out to be a popular match-up, Marvel will just have Northstar make a deal with the devil and wipe it from existence.

Yeah dude: if you “hate homosexuality,” you’re a homophobe. That is what it means. You can’t complain about it.

Anyway: the bible says all types of stuff. All types of stupid shit that you don’t believe in. It is over a thousand pages. How come you never hear people screaming about tattoos or children being put to death for disobeying their fathers?

Fuck off, bigots. God cannot and will not protect you from being seen for what you are.

One Million Bigots say that they ‘know’ homosexuality is a sin. Shouldn’t that read that they ‘believe’ homosexuality is a sin. Thats how faith works isn’t it, belief over evidence or proof? Man is falible, God is not, isn’t that also what they believe. well God didn’t write the Bible, men did (some of them might even have been gay men – shudder).

It’s the 21st century guys, time we left these medieval notions and systems of control behind and replaced them with rationality. Still if they didn’t have faith they’d have nothing – they might have to open a book (one without a cross on the front) and learn something real. We read comics – at least we know that they’re fiction.

Jesus hung around whith whores and tax collecters in those scriptures so I am sure he would be fine with a gay guy who fights crime.

It bothers me when narrow minded, angry people claim that they embody Christianity.

Censorship of art, literature, what we can and can’t see and hear. hmmmm … sounds like they should cosy on up with the Iranians or the Chinese. Maybe their second favourite book is Mein Kampf. Doesn’t matter what you believe too many people have given up everything so we can live in a free, democratic society. There are millions around the world who do not. Land of the Free … not if these bigots have anything to do with it!

I would personally prefer it if marvel an DC didn’t put gay crap in comics. They’re trying so hard to be current it’s a little pathetic.

I would prefer it if Heliios didn’t post homophobic blather. He is trying so hard to be prujudiced it’s a little pathetic.

““““““““““““““““““““`

I find the whole concept amusing. It sounds like ‘how can they use dwarves in that story and have them not have beards? Tolkien clearly states that dwarves have beards!’

My work of fiction takes precendence over yours!

Two Bed Two Bath

May 25, 2012 at 5:55 am

I can’t speak for anyone else, but I’m going to buy a crap-ton of copies of Astonishing 51 and hand them out at playgrounds and Sunday schools.

I remember the first comic I got as a little kid. Superman was fighting up in the air with Lex Luthor in his green armor. There was also a Hulk issue where the big green guy was stuck on some foreign world.

I don’t quite know what I would have made of superhero comics if the first issue I bough out was some guy’s coming out announcement.

Not that I’m for a minute agreeing with these moms and their ‘homosexuality is a sin’ shtick, but I wonder about the need for superhero comics to explore these issues.

More like “One Million Glassy-Eyed, Badly-Dressed, Semi-Literate Harpies”.

Wow. You folks are just soooo progressive in your thinking. I disagree with the OMM as much as anyone, but you know what? They have a right to their opinion, they have the right to express their opinion, and they feel that they need to voice their opinion to protect the way of life that they want for their families. However, I find it hilarious that you oh so progressive thinkers are so quick to condemn them for their Christian beliefs, calling them names and criticizing their beliefs. Would you be so vocal if this were a Muslim organization? Would you be willing to put your names to such arguments in such a case. Islam has zero tolerance for homosexuals, in fact, persons suspected of homosexuality in the Middle East are regularly killed in horrible fashion, yet none of the ‘progressive minded’ American organizations say one single word. Homosexuality is a mental aborration that affects millions. That is not a hateful term, it is a factual term. People are born that way and have events in their lives that create the situation, just as anyone suffering from depression or schizophrenia. It is a challenge that, if you so believe, God put to some people to challenge their and others faith and tolerance.

“Would you be so vocal if this were a Muslim organization?”

Uh, yeah… obviously.

Homosexuality isn’t a ‘mental aborration’. Religion is the ‘mental aborration’.

Stop trying to force your delusions on others.

“I disagree with the OMM as much as anyone, but you know what? They have a right to their opinion, they have the right to express their opinion …”

Yes, just as everyone else has the right to express their displeasure with OMM’s stance.

“However, I find it hilarious that you oh so progressive thinkers are so quick to condemn them for their Christian beliefs, calling them names and criticizing their beliefs. …”

What’s hilarious about “progressive thinkers” condemning what they consider to be a backward stance that seeks to limit or abolish the rights of a minority?

“Would you be so vocal if this were a Muslim organization? Would you be willing to put your names to such arguments in such a case.”

As long as we’re playing with hypotheticals: Would a Muslim organization enjoy the same status and reach in the United States as the American Family Association, the nonprofit organization that cooked up the One Million Moms project? Get back to me when a Muslim group owns 180 U.S. radio stations. (Can you imagine? The House of Representatives would be pushing for an overhaul of FCC regulations before the first station was purchased.)

“Homosexuality is a mental aborration that affects millions. That is not a hateful term, it is a factual term. People are born that way and have events in their lives that create the situation, just as anyone suffering from depression or schizophrenia.”

You’re comparing homosexuality to mental disorders? Nice.

OMM’s rationale is ridicolous. I highly doubt a child would suddenly want a boyfriend just because he saw it in a comic book or any other form of media. Get a grip OMM.

Can anyone tell me what part of Christian Dogma advocates intolerance? Where does it say ‘hate thy neighbor?’ Trouble is there are some out there who probably can answer my questions, as like the Koran, the Bible is open to different interpretation depending on the wielder’s agenda (Yeh, I did say wielder). I prefer to interpret it for the most part as saying ‘live and let live’ and don’t be a c**t to others.

Still it does raise some interesting queries such as who would win in a fight, Jesus or Marvel?

Jesus: “Honour my father brother”
Hulk: “Leave Hulk alone”
Jesus: “Stay brother, share my Jewish, not Christian in the slightest, sandwiches”
Hulk: “HULK SMASH!”

Green arrow's missing Goatee

May 25, 2012 at 6:47 am

OMM are worried that kids might ask questions about homosexuality if they read a comic. Good kids should ask questions and when they do the OMM can answer them with their own brand of narrowmindedness as their parents did to them when they asked questions about the Bible. I wonder which has fucked kids minds up more? As others have said the Bible is open to interpretaion which leads me to ask what did Jesus mean when he said “Get thee behind me Satan”. Oo-er.

First off, comics aren’t really targeted to kids anymore (at least mainstream continuity comics).

Second off, no kid probably knows who Northstar even is.

Third off, who cares. It’s just the evolution of the character.

Give Helios a break, Rusty. He’s still trying to come to terms with the fact that there’s no such thing as a Kinsey 0.

“Would you be so vocal if this were a Muslim organization? Would you be willing to put your names to such arguments in such a case.”
Absolutely. Anyone who uses archaic superstition as justification for bigotry deserves a proper scolding.

“Islam has zero tolerance for homosexuals, in fact, persons suspected of homosexuality in the Middle East are regularly killed in horrible fashion, yet none of the ‘progressive minded’ American organizations say one single word.”
That notion that no one speaks out against laws targeting homosexuals in other countries is patently false. If you choose to ignore those who speak out, that’s a you problem.

“Homosexuality is a mental aborration that affects millions.”
Oh. You’re insane. Now I get it.

Kinda hope DC’s gay character turns out to be the Spectre.

“I AM THE VENGEANCE OF GOD! oooo get those drapes.”

Sorry about the un-pc gay stereotype there, but before you shout at me, it would be kinda cool wouldn’t it? Serious point though, we do all tend to get a little too politically correct these days don’t we and most people can take a joke unless they’re from Stepford like the OMM.

Actually, nobody “has the right to their opinion” if their opinion is hateful bigotry.

Fuck that, fuck off and fuck you too.

OMM just needs to shut the hell up. I’m Christian too and accept people who are gay. Times have changed and the only one who can judge people on their sins is God. OMM is trying to become God. OMM, if you’re so against people who are gay because you think it’s a sin, then let the one among you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone!

@Ayo
“Actually, nobody “has the right to their opinion” if their opinion is hateful bigotry.”
Who said so and who determines what is hateful bigotry anyway? If enough cigarette lovers get together and start denouncing anti-smoking campaigns as hateful bigotry, is that right? Would anyone claim that Israelis are hateful bigots for attacking Africans (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jL1hI82ZE2tlyJwK2ooKi7GFeiRQ?docId=692031b7e11e4ec6b88e797d5d9c00b8).

Dye the Beast pink I say

May 25, 2012 at 7:33 am

Comics – Fiction. Rather bloody entertaining fiction in my view.

Bible – Parachute for the ignorant and those who find the 21st century a tad complex.

What do they say if their kids ask if Thor is really a God? Probably something like “It’s just a story dear”. Reflect real life in the 21st century though … the reality that some of those that walk among us are, shudder to think, gay, and it’s all too much.

Tsk. Haven’t the muties suffered enough bigotry from extreme conservatism. I mean they said that their abilities would destroy the world and yet those brave X-Men have saved it time and again. Shit … I’ve just confused fiction with reality again haven’t I. C’mon they’ve finally made Northstar interesting and relevant after decades of trying and for that I praise them. Shit I’ve mixed up religion with it now, imagine doing that.

If one million moms have a problem with gays then they should point the finger at themselves!! They the ones having gay kids! J/K :)

I was predicting this kind of reaction, but it is part of any marketing plan. You make more and more noise, wait for the hate groups take charge and use the hate groups to promote your material because “it is so good it even get their hate groups against it” marketing. You don’t make the comics something cool, you make it cooler because read it is a protest against the right wing radicals or because you are going against one million moms

@Eric
“OMM, if you’re so against people who are gay because you think it’s a sin, then let the one among you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone!”
You’ve forgotten the last word on that mini-story which was “Go and sin no more”. And homosexuality is counted as sin.

And we see how well the Ellen strategy paid off for Penney’s.

Uh…if we took the Bible word for word (as many people claim to do when pointing it out when arguing homosexuality), there would be many, many things we would not be allowed to do. It’s these idiots who misinterpret the Bible as the actual word of God that fudges everything up. I’m gay, I believe in God, but I do not believe the Bible is His word. I wish people would just…realize that.

That being said, I’m more interested in DC’s gay news over Marvel’s. I couldn’t care about this forced wedding, but am very curious about DC’s character reveal. I hope they have the guts to make is Wally West.

Yeah, telling kids not to do or buy something always works. Marvel and DC are thanking the ‘one woman with 30 cats & a laptop’ for the free press.

Now by mothers, don’t they mean women who cant raise their sons right and explain to them that being gay isn’t
a choice and that some boys were born this way. If they did maybe their sons will be educated about these things and not become the bullies that are ruining America. Be understanding not ignorant…

@ussescort

Would you be so vocal if this were a Muslim organization? Would you be willing to put your names to such arguments in such a case.

Yes. Muslim bigot scumbags, Christian bigot scumbags… all the same to me. Thank you for playing Jihad Envy! Better luck next time!

Islam has zero tolerance for homosexuals, in fact, persons suspected of homosexuality in the Middle East are regularly killed in horrible fashion, yet none of the ‘progressive minded’ American organizations say one single word

So… what exactly? So you and your Christian buddies haven’t lynched any gays lately. What do you want, a ****ing cookie? YOU’RE NOT SUPPOSED TO LYNCH PEOPLE! You don’t get extra credit for not lynching people!

It is a challenge that, if you so believe, God put to some people to challenge their and others faith and tolerance.

If so, you just failed.

As a scholar of the Good Book, I would like to point out this passage that has meant a lot to me.

Timothy 2:12

I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent

These moms need to get over it! What they really should be worried about is trying to find a better way to cover up the fact that while they are spending most of their time with this they should really be worried about their husbands cheating on them. People are SOOO stupid!! Get with 2012 gays are going no where! Realize this you crazy moms… Heterosexual (men and women) marrages are a prime example of why people grow up to commit adultry and are violent cause they see some of you ignorat and SIN committing parents. Then they begin following in YOUR footsteps! Stop worring about Gay issues and worry about your own damn issues. YOU LAME OVER THE HILL HIPPOCRATES! Im gonna go make out wiht my boyfriend now!

OH and another thing! So the parent that said in this article that it would be crazy to have a little boy saying I want a boyfriend or husband like x-man. LOL well just wait till they start saying I want another women like daddy!

Dear Normal Americans,

It’s shit like this that gives your country a bad name outside the U.S.

Seriously, why do you guys put up with it? Why is this right wing shit even allowed *and* seemingly encouraged? For a country that almost single-handedly created Political Correctness, you do seem to have a pretty high ratio of bigots, sexists and generally warped, judgemental assholes.

MajorSpoilersRunByHomophobes

May 25, 2012 at 9:57 am

Kudos to the folks at this site allowing an unfiltered and open coversation on this topic. A nice change of pace from MajorSpoilers where only bigots are allowed to post unfiltered.

(Firstly, someone else posted as Phoenix up above. This person was obviously a woman, and Christian, just stating, this has been my handle on this site since 2003, and I am a gay male with a belief in god, I am a different poster than above)

E.G.
May 24, 2012 at 3:56 pm

@E.G.:” @mostlyharmless — How do you explain a gay man later having “straight” relationships with women…by choice? Is he living a lie? Would you tell him that?”

Phoenix: What I would say, they are most likely bending to the pressures of people like you, who try to put centuries old stigma’s on them, for whatever reason you deem to do so. They probably cannot handle the persecution, hate and intolerance that many people still sadly demonstrate. It wasn’t too long ago that blacks were discriminated against for being born of a different color, or women for being born a woman, not having the right to vote, being pushed down just for being born how they are.

@E.G. “There are numerous instances of homosexual behavior derived from environmental factors, e.g. a child molested by the pedo uncle, or a gay teen.”

Phoenix: your facts are baseless. It’s ironic you state that this other person’s points have no validity, yet you present the same “type” of argument.

@E.G. “If you can provide incontrovertible proof that homosexuality is 100% established in the womb, without grey areas or X factors, I will shut up.”

Phoenix: E.G. if YOU can provide incontrovertible proof that the bible was written 100% by god himself, instead of those sinful men that walked the earth, with dreadful agendas of their own, using propaganda to achieve what they wanted. I will SHUT UP! Ironically again, religion is strictly faith based, no facts whatsoever, religious defense is strictly gray areas and x factors. You cannot base your beliefs of “faith” on the same intricacies you use to deem other peoples points invalid, and not in and of itself prove yourself invalid in the same sentence.

The bottom line of all of this is simple. Everyone has the right to live their lives as such. You being a Christian and judging others just as your god says not to, is, by your bible, is just as equal a sin as homosexuality. People who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. Do you eat shellfish? Swine? Do you get your hair cut on the Sabbath? All of these are equal sins, YET, they are choices made by Christians everyday. Being gay is not a choice. Being gay is not a sin. The bible was a tool used by people of power, and by the church to scare people and repress behaviors that took control away from the regimes because those people living their lives that way made the church and kings look a fool, using bullying and scare tactics that are (or certainly should be by now) archaic and undignified in behavior.

Amen, Phoenix.

Great post, Phoenix!

The only religious text I put any credence toward is Preacher (aka The Book of Ennis).

are there even 1 million moms?

I would assume the number is around 20 moms, 500 rich politicians/vested fundamentalist christian interests (as opposed to normal christians who just live their lives and don’t put stuff on others), and falsely signing the names of a good 400 thousand people or so (and rounded to a million).

News flash! Comic books contain social commentary, in case you don’t remember, it’s been that way since the 1950s.

Here’s another thing that may surprise you…not everyone is a Christian, and they might not care what that religion has to say about things, and as an American, you should be defending that right.

Dear Normal Americans,

It’s shit like this that gives your country a bad name outside the U.S.

Seriously, why do you guys put up with it? Why is this right wing shit even allowed *and* seemingly encouraged? For a country that almost single-handedly created Political Correctness, you do seem to have a pretty high ratio of bigots, sexists and generally warped, judgemental assholes.

I dont think its that we have an unusually high number of idiots among our population, it’s that the idiots here tend to b!tch and moan a lot more, and a lot louder, than in other countries. We Americans have developed a sense of entitlement where we think our opinions outweigh all others. Add our larger than normal population into things, our higher than average access to technology, and those idiots end up being heard more often than they should.

It’s the problem with freedom of speech. Even the morons get to say what they want, regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

As for the issue at hand, One Million Moms can go to hell. As others have said, put that energy into something productive rather than spreading hate and discontent. Really, you think a comic book is going to convince someone to embrace a life of oppression and bigotry? You really think someone would actively decide “You know what? Life is too easy and there are far too many eligible members of the opposite sex out there to pick from. Hell with it, I’ll be gay and forevermore have to deal with the shortsighted and ignorant sheep.”

Im a straight and happily married man, and this sort of attitude makes me ashamed for humanity. Seriously, have you people not realized this sort of blanket hatred is last century?

So, let me understand this (I almost said, “get this straight” – hah!): Comics influence what we become as adults? Then, since my favorite comic book as a kid was “Herbie,” I should be fat, near-sighted, and have a pocket-protector full of lollipops, right? (Google it, whippersnappers, and get off my lawn!) Oh, nevermind, here: you emus are too lazy to do even that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbie_Popnecker

This whole thing is stupid…

“One Million Moms”, please, I’m guessing it’s a few churches, so roughly 200 moms. And even if they get an online petition, the other “million” moms will have no clue, or don’t honestly care, what anyone is talking about. I find it funny that “One Million Moms” worries about this, but not about the U.S. education system or dealing with drugs in their local neighborhood. I wonder which poor 7-11 they will stage a protest at?

The comic itself is silly. I’m all for equal rights, but I fail to see this as nothing more then a publicity stunt, which then is taking a major debate the U.S. is having and taking advantage of it. That alone is poor taste, and technically poor writing. And I really don’t see how this comic is going to make anyone, at any age, more aware about anything…well, except how Logan is going to sneak a beer into the wedding.

What’s really sad is that there are a dozen other REAL problems in the world, but for some dumb reason this becomes an issue (and always on an election year, Hmmmmm).

Overall, I speak for EVERYONE who buys comics (or illegally reads them online) when I say we just want our “Hulk/Thor” fight, or “Hulk/Thing”, or “Thing/Superman”, or “Superman/Supreme”, or…you get the idea.

To any straight person who thinks that sexuality and attraction is a choice, tell me – when did YOU decide to be hetero? Why, there must have been that one moment you said, “you know what, I’m going to be straight!” if you think that this is what gays do. Or maybe, to use an inverse example from above, some pedo Aunt molested you, or some straight teen. Anyway, surely you remember such a life-alterating decision, so straights, let’s hear it – when DID you decide to be hetero?

If only lions had been more plentiful..

@Syzygy, you make me want to break out my old Dreadstar comics.

Who Cares N. E. Way

May 25, 2012 at 4:19 pm

From reading these comments, there are an awful lot of hateful people on all sides of this “discussion”.

“If only lions had been more plentiful”, talks of “lynchings” , wishing death or bodily harm on people because they dont agree with one another? Awful.

No side has the right to preach to any about tolerance and hate speech as far as I am concerned after reading through a great deal of this tripe. It’s like reading transcripts from Jerry Springer— instead of intelligent conversations from grown up people.

Face it folks….whether any side wants to admit it….you are on this forum because you read and enjoy superheroes. Reading and enjoying comics alone was enough to get you beat up by jocks and other bullies back in the day. Stop bullying each other.

We have alcoholic superheroes (Iron Man), multiple personality heroes (Moon Knight and Crazy Jane), and we have had gay heroes like Northstar for years now. The only reason this is even an issue is politics. Pure and simple. Its a political hot button issue right now. Just wait until the next right to life movement becomes the spotlight of the political arena. Then we will have issues dealing with abortion….and people can fight over that.

This is NOT a “conservative Christian initiative”. One Million Moms is a front for the American Family Association, a Christian fundamentalist outfit that wants to ban anything it does not like. The AFA used to bully sponsors of TV shows but when that became ineffective it switched to gay-bashing.

AFA founder Donald Wildmon hates the entertainment industry and believes Jews are to blame for everything that’s wrong with this country. DC Comics is owned by Time Warner. Marvel is owned by The Walt Disney Co.

Phoenix, you said it all.

Who Cares N. E. Way:

Oh don’t get me wrong. This isn’t some “Oh, I disagree with them, therefore DIE DIE DIE.” Youtube comment. My desire for the entire religion (in fact, all religions) comes from the fact that the entire human institution of religion has been used to justify doing terrible things to one another to please a tribal sky god that was pretty chatty early on but seems to have developed into a deaf mute as time has progressed. Sure, science has made mistakes as well – e.g. eugenics programs flourished in the early 20th century. It just didn’t take nearly as long to accept it was wrong and we stopped snipping the vas deferens of foster children.

It’s one of the primary differences between religion and science. We don’t have an infallible invisible friend barking dubious orders at us, encouraging us to kill each other.

But this isn’t necessarily an issue about a comic. This is a social issue – something comics have tackled – and famously capitulated to – in the past. In the past, the comic code promoted good, decent and Christian viewpoints. Cops are always the good guy, no “sexual perversion/sexual abnormalities” etc etc. And it largely stemmed from viewpoints of people that I described before. Frankly I’m proud of Marvel for taking a stance that was generally the domain of smaller publishers.

They’re certainly welcome to their viewpoint, but when a movement begins dying off or they become less relevant, as it is with religion, the louder, the more obnoxious and occasionally the more violent they become. And to be frank, daydream wishes of more Christians being fed to the lions 2000 years ago is a far cry from bombing an abortion clinic, going to protest a dead soldier or child, or killing someone because you consider their lifestyle to be wrong, be it being gay or being that of a westerner.

In the end, I know that people always talk about their religions being a deeply personal thing. Unfortunately when it comes to their religion, it tends not to be so personal that they will shut up about it, especially when its something someone else is doing that has no impact to them personally. So yes, more lions would have solved that problem quite nicely.

Should we tolerate intolerance?

If your answer is yes, take your meds.

Syzygy wrote

Yes. Muslim bigot scumbags, Christian bigot scumbags… all the same to me. Thank you for playing Jihad Envy! Better luck next time!

Actually, ussescort’s question is a fair one since one of the young X-Men, Dust, is MUSLIM and thus very likely to disprove of Northstar’s sin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dust_%28comics%29

You should have seen her and Surge go at it over clothing styles.

I wonder if Marvel has the guts to have Dust skip Northstar’s so-called wedding in protest.

Ayo

Actually, nobody “has the right to their opinion” if their opinion is hateful bigotry.

Actually, the First Amendment protects ALL free speech, including opinions you disagree with.

If you hate diversity of viewpoints, you can always move to communist hellhole like North Korea. I’ll pay your way.

You know, in a way I’m grateful for OMM. With comics struggling in sales they actually bring people in to read the “offending” comic in question. This increases sales and potentially changes a few people’s opinions on homosexuality because they like the couple in question.

So what we should do instead of sending hate mail to OMM is to send them a list of decent independent comics that are struggling particularly hard in sales and which portray GLBT people in a positive light and ask them to publicly denounce and boycott those titles. They didn’t catch on when the Archie boycott backfired; maybe we can get them to boost the sales on a few more books before they finally catch on.

@Andy Nystrom

Considering how the Obama issue of Amazing Spider-Man didn’t result in long term sales increases, I doubt this Northstar stunt will help the X-books. This is a contrast to the “Death of Superman” which really DID boost sales for years.

IDUNNO wrote

And you know what OMMs in 20 years you’ll be dead and none of your opinions will matter. So if you see this read it, and know with every bit of hate in my heart, I hate people like you. You destroyed the white picket fence theory not the gays.

Back in the 1970s when abortion was legalized, the pro-choice movement would remain the majority and predicted that pro-lifers would die off since it was made up of out of touch old people.

Now, in 2012, pro-choice Americans are the minority mainly because so many YOUNG people are pro-life:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/154838/Pro-Choice-Americans-Record-Low.aspx

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/naral-head-intensity-gap-between-pro-lifers-and-pro-aborts-could-threaten-f

So, in a couple of generations, don’t be shocked if the very youth who support “gay marriage” eventually do a 180 degree turn.

Oh brother i get so tired people saying one sin above another. It Is All Sin. There is no grade level.Either you obey God or the World And it is choice. You get so far in it is hard to come back. And it is a choice to disobey God.

I’d pay someone to dress as Northstar.

The derp is strong with OMM.

@Emm
“Dear Normal Americans, It’s shit like this that gives your country a bad name outside the U.S…”
I’m from outside America (from South-East Asia) and I don’t see this as giving bad name to the US. In fact, personally I find OMM quite valiant for taking a stand (though whether the stand would be effective is another matter). I’ve heard of another group launching a boycott against Starbuck’s for using some insect dye. Shall we denounce this group as well?

@Jasmine
“Here’s another thing that may surprise you…not everyone is a Christian…”
That’s true, some people are Muslims, who generally are even more hostile to homosexuals (and anything Western for that matter).

“…and they might not care what that religion has to say about things…”
And many people care for what religion has to say about things, so defend that right then.

@Paul Sarlo
“My desire for the entire religion (in fact, all religions)…”
I suppose murderous non-religious folks like the French Revolutionaries, Stalin, Pol Pot, Enver Hoxha and serial killer Jeffrey Dahmer are your heroes.

“Sure, science has made mistakes as well – e.g. eugenics programs flourished in the early 20th century. It just didn’t take nearly as long to accept it was wrong and we stopped snipping the vas deferens of foster children.”
Eugenics ideals hasn’t really died out, check out reports of babies with Down’s syndrome getting aborted for that reason.

“Unfortunately when it comes to their religion, it tends not to be so personal that they will shut up about it, especially when its something someone else is doing that has no impact to them personally.”
Let’s see, if some Japanese person decided to chomp down on whale meat, it has no impact to me personally or anyone else for that matter. But many people believe in interfering with the Japanese merely for their diet.

“So yes, more lions would have solved that problem quite nicely.”
How nice of you to admit your murderous plans. You’re the one with killing intent here, not OMM ironically. Who’s intolerant now?

@Sirkowski
“Should we tolerate intolerance? If your answer is yes, take your meds”.
Who defines what is intolerance? I’m Chinese and I’m sick of mostly Western people criticising us for eating shark fin soup. Maybe anti-shark fin soup campaigns should be denounced as intolerant. Who’s with me?

Funny, gays cant marry or have kids, but all those “moms” can!…Sad world!!!

Quek Khai How

May 26, 2012 at 6:37 am

Reality is cruel. Discrimination will always exist due to “normal people”‘s prejudice against something out of the norm. Do you know what your children are? A person sexuality is not conditioned, it is just that we prefer guys. Mommies and Daddies all we ask for is acceptance. Being gay is regarded by many as committing a sin. Society’s discrimination, religions’ disapproval had added extra stress on us. I am already forty plus. What do I still want to hide? I suffer from depression and I had enough. In my country being gay is totally unacceptable. But we are here to stay. History had taught us, discrimination is destructive. All we need is support and acceptance. Do you know how stressful in being a closet gay?

I grew up reading a comic book called the Bible, and it didn’t make me straight, so I really doubt a Marvel comic book is going to turn any kids gay.

I’m largely liberal,and have never been religious,but firmly draw the line at treatment of same-sex sexual relationships as unobjectionable.No superhero who thinks it appropriate to gratify same-sex sexual attraction is a fit role model.If a predilection for an activity justifies that activity,then nothing is wrong.It doesn’t matter if the orientation is a choice,indulging it is an always-wrong choice.

So many people are so embarrrassing to me as a human.

God is not offended by homosexuality. God is offended by HATE.

Shut up. Learn about love. Let it be.

One million moms, and not a brain among them.

One Million mums.

But barely a brain between them.

@RMW

I know arguing with you is a complete waste of time, but I think it’s important you understand you’re a complete areshole, and you’re fallacious arguements (seriously, you hit every note, poisoning the well, straw man, slippery slope) do incredibly little to justify an attitude that says one human being is less valuable than another because of who they love.

I read a short story a while ago about an evangelical christian who dies and goes to heaven, but it looks like hell and they’re surrounded by people, atheists, jews, homosexuals, who they believe should be in hell as well. It’s eventually explained to the poor fool that this is their heaven, tailored for them, that they would be happiest for eternity seeing the people they despise being tortured in hell, rather than being in heaven.

The character reminds me of you.

Yes…the comic book industry will be “deeply concerned” about losing the one million conservative prunish mum’s demographic! *dies laughing*

As much as I believe this whole story arc is nothing more than a publicity stunt to sell comics and Lui’s way of patting herself on the back, seeing a story like this makes me realize how much this type of event is needed.

I am pretty sure if secret six wouldn’t have ended we would of saw a gay threeway marriage. <,< If they would of protested that maybe dc would of kept it around after the new 52.

Can you imagine little boys saying, "I want a boyfriend or husband like X-Men?" I would slap my kid and say in this house we use in !!!! now say it again "I want a boyfriend or husband like in X-Men?"

Craig Robinson

May 27, 2012 at 8:07 am

TheAndyKirby wrote: “I agree that the Bible says homosexuality is a sin. I think that the Bible is God’s true word to us.”

The Bible also decries eating shellfish as an “abomination” (Leviticus 11:12). This is the same language the Bible uses against homosexuality. Are you, or Million Moms, going to boycott Red Lobster because their menu is a sin against God?

The Bible also condones polygamy. King Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines (First Kings 11:1-3). Isn’t that more of an affront to marriage than a same sex couple in one monogamous marriage? While you ponder these questions, allow me to pose a few more.

These Million Moms… do you think they still sell their daughters into slavery by the guidelines set forth in Exodous 21:7?

I have to work at my job every other weekend. Should my employer put me to death, or should the congregations of the local churchs? (Exodous 25:2).

Leviticus 21:20 says that anyone with a defect of the eye may not approach the altar of God. Since I’m nearsighted and require glasses, does this mean I can may not attend church?

This is a touchy subject here in Indianapolis becase we just drafted quarterback Andrew Luck for the Colts. Touching the skin of dead pig makes on unclean (Leviticus 11:6). Should we send Luck packing? Are the Million Moms going to boycott the NFL?

Thank you for showing us the enduring and inflexible wisdom of the Bible.

On last thought; lest you and the rest of the Bible-quoting flat earth society continue to denigrate and condemn everyone unlike yourselves, First John 2:9 tells us, “he who claims the light but hates his brother is still in darkness.”

Here is a the thing. If Comic book readers are considered nerds/geeks, (which I am proud to be nerdcore) and computer hackers/computer geniuses are considered nerds/geeks meaning groups like Anonymous. Which some of these groups hack computer databases which no one knew possible in just minutes while being bored. What does One Million Moms think will happen when they up set these people by messing with their comics. I know if it was me I would not want to anger a geniuses, their are lots of movies and comics that teach us what a bad idea that is. This shows that One Million Moms dose not even read comics, what grounds do they have to meddle in our affairs. They don’t like it then they should continue doing what they do best and keep on brain washing their kids and not allow them to buy the comic. A mothers job is to protect their own children, not to censor entertainment provided to the masses. I do believe that this group may have their own priorities mixed up.

Seeing people act gay does NOT make you want to become gay… and that’s where radical right have it wrong. They’re convinced if kids are around gay people – they turn gay. It’s not like becoming a werewolf… you can’t get ‘the gay’…

@Craig Robinson

Your puny questions are answered in greater detail here: http://www.tektonics.org/lp/lauraletter.html

King Solomon’s multiple wives are a violation of the command at Deuteronomy 17:17, so no, polygamy is not condoned.

Oh and as for 1 John 2:9, since it refers to “brothers”, it has no bearing on people who are unlike Christians.

@Jacqueline B
“God is not offended by homosexuality. God is offended by HATE.”
Wrong answer, God is definitely offended by homosexuality (Leviticus 18:22). And His prescribed punishment is to “cut them off” from the people (Leviticus 18:29)

CogInTheWheel

May 28, 2012 at 6:09 am

Guh, enough with the “studies” done by random people you dont know but happen to agree with. I wrote a paper on studies once and found that most of those have the same credibility as a poll on a website….most “studies” dont even use a proper control, therefor making the whole thing null and void. Yet people are still toting them around as some sort of credible response……unless you did the study yourself and conducted it PROPERLY, then it aint much of a study on anything but human error. The study should be peer-reviewed as well, so any errors can be found, discussed, and fixed.

As for scripture, all those different books and versions contradict themselves almost by page. “love thy neighbor, but if they’re gay throw slaughtered animals at their door because I dont like them”. “dont judge lest ye be judged…..but I’m about to judge people from the future that dont even exist yet”. We’re talking about convoluted scripture’s that suggest women can never teach or have authority over men and that divorcing/remarrying is considered adultery.

I’m surprised these morons haven’t figured out yet that adults read comic books, too. And yes, there should be both gay AND straight role models, because different kids have different orientations that will manifest as they mature.

What’s next, OMM? Banning Archie’s Sonic comics because “talking animals and technomancy could confuse children into thinking magic and familiars are a good thing?” How about banning the Green Lantern for his thinly-veiled environmentalism? And don’t get me started on Wonder Woman. :P

@chrisJones>> yes, yes it is.

sorry if It’s been answered, but the replies got TL:DR for me.

It’s into discussions like this that I often want to quote the exchange from West Wing (although I almost never watched the show) when the President had a bible-thumping talk radio host in his office along with a bunch of other people (Craig Robertson mentioned many of the same questions above, May 27 8:07). The clip is at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r024iK2a7w

but here’s a transcript from wikiquotes:
Bartlet: I like your show. I like how you call homosexuality an abomination.
Dr. Jenna Jacobs: I don’t say homosexuality is an abomination, Mr. President. The Bible does.
President Josiah Bartlet: Yes it does. Leviticus.
Dr. Jenna Jacobs: 18:22.
President Josiah Bartlet: Chapter and verse. I wanted to ask you a couple of questions while I have you here. I’m interested in selling my youngest daughter into slavery as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. She’s a Georgetown sophomore, speaks fluent Italian, always cleared the table when it was her turn. What would a good price for her be? While thinking about that, can I ask another? My Chief of Staff Leo McGarry insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly says he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself or is it okay to call the police? Here’s one that’s really important because we’ve got a lot of sports fans in this town: touching the skin of a dead pig makes one unclean. Leviticus 11:7. If they promise to wear gloves, can the Washington Redskins still play football? Can Notre Dame? Can West Point? Does the whole town really have to be together to stone my brother John for planting different crops side by side? Can I burn my mother in a small family gathering for wearing garments made from two different threads? Think about those questions, would you? One last thing: while you may be mistaking this for your monthly meeting of the Ignorant Tight-Ass Club, in this building, when the President stands, nobody sits.

The point about this is that these jokers are picking and choosing which parts of the bible to “enforce”.

People need to get some perspective. The bible is distorted by the values of the 1st century AD. Men (and perhaps Mary Magdalene depending on your perspective on John) wrote it and put into it all their values on how people were to live. Its ridden with contradiction. Also, what makes the Bible as we have it the WORD of GOD and not all the other books that were banned? Homosexuality was a ‘pagan’ thing (think of the greeks). Everything pagan was evil to the early Christians.

you really think that homosexuality is such a bad thing well this sit sucks you suck and i think marvel heroes should at least have a gay person/people. im gonna tell every1 i know about this and i may even tell the police.

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