Robot 6

Quote of the Day | Moore vs. Morrison, Round … something

alan moore“I announce From Hell and in short order he ‘has the idea’ for a comic strip account of a historical serial murderer. I announce Lost Girls, a lengthy erotic work involving characters from fiction, and within a few months he has somehow managed to conceptualise a Vertigo mini-series along exactly those lines. What I at first believed to be the actions of an ordinary comic-business career plagiarist came to take on worrying aspects of cargo cultism, as if this funny little man believed that by simply duplicating all of my actions, whether he understood them or not, he could somehow become me and duplicate my success. It would appear that at one stage, as an example, he had concluded that the secret to being a big-time acclaimed comic-writer was to be found in having a memorable hairstyle. Perhaps unsurprisingly, the possession of talent, hard-earned craft or even his own ideas would seem never to have occurred to him.”

Alan Moore, delving deep into his history with Grant Morrison (such that it is), whom he refers to as “some feverishly fixated non-entity” and “my own personal 18th century medicinal leech,” who “through the early years of this present century [...] somehow managed to perpetuate his career seemingly without the accomplishment of any major or memorable works.”

The interview, conducted via email by Padraig O’Mealoid, is a fascinating and contentious read, with Moore also taking aim at journalist Laura Sneddon and The Independent. But he devotes a lot of space to Morrison.

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that article…how the mighty have fallen

I think the fascination is all from Moore to Morrison. Why doesn’t he just buy the man some posies?

Wow…what a bitter, cantankerous old man he has become. I think he believed his own hype a little too much, no? Don’t get me wrong – Watchmen is fantastic, a true classic. His work on Supreme is an awesome love-letter to DC’s silver age Superman. The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen is a great take on Victorian-era adventure fiction. And V for Vendetta and From Hell are great dramatic stories. Top 10 is an awesome take on a police drama as a genre mash-up, and Promethea is an amazing fantasy story that explores real-world occultism. But if you will notice, most of Moore’s classics are really re-inventions of someone else’s work. For example, Watchmen was originally supposed to be about Charlton’s super-heroes (Blue Beetle, Captain Atom, Phantom Lady, etc.) until the higher-ups at DC decided that wasn’t the right vehicle for these characters.

Now, that’s not to say Moore is bad or wrong for doing so. But to be honest, I think I see more originality in Grant Morrison’s work by a long way. The Invisibles literally hacked my perception of reality and my dreams for weeks after I read it. Heavy. I do think he relies (to an extent) on taking older concepts and re-imagining them in a trippy, post-modern sensibility, but in a way that celebrates them. This is not dissimilar to what Alan Moore has done. Now, if Moore is pointing that out, he has a valid observation. Slagging on a fellow creator and calling him (essentially) a parasite, a hack, and a rip-off artist…well, that’s horrid and unprofessional.

Really wishing we had the Moore of yesteryears back, not this tired, angry, old man.

Ohhh, I don’t know. Writers bitching about writers is a centuries old tradition that whilst providing rare amusement to the wider public, they both apparently can’t resist. I’m quite sure Grant appreciates any kind of acknowledgement from the grand-wizard of Northampton. Well Moore has some free press coverage and now Morrison’s got something to occupy himself with over the weekend. Everyone’s a winner!

Moore hates Morrison and Morrison hates Millar. Do I have that right?

” To be brutally honest, I’d prefer it if, as with the Before Watchmen re-creators, their associates and their readers, admirers of Grant Morrison’s work would please stop reading mine, as I don’t think it fair that my respect and affection for my own readership should be compromised in any way by people that I largely believe to be shallow and undiscriminating.”

I am inclined to respect his wishes… Very sad how far Mr Moore has fallen. Can’t even respect different tastes at this point….

Moore and Morrison could seriously use an arbiter–and I’d only be too happy to take on the job.

It’s sad to hear your hero screech,
and compare another to a “leech”.

This “feud” appears to be very one-sided. Grampa mad. I will, as a fan of Morrison’s work, grant Cranky ol’ Alan his wish though and stop reading any of his work. You win Grand Wizard of Senility, you win.

I’d be curious to see some literary critics break down Moore’s writing.

Also, if a woman studies prof could interview Moore about rape, and a black studies prof could interview him about using a black face character, we might get to see Moore really take on people who can challenge his statements instead of vomit justifications.

Grant Morrison is a stalker, and as Moore says, he never developed his own voice as a writer, que appeared on the scene, and has since then remained as a ”writer who writes stories in an Alan Moore style”.

Grant Morrison last stalker action i remember (with complicity of the artist James Robinson) was puting Alan Moore’s face into a child molester and killer character in the Happy miniseries (Image). And there still people here saying that Alan Moore is the obssesed one?

Man, and people thought that Shia Ledoof obsession/stalking to Daniel Clowes was creepy…

He seems quite adamant that his work and those who enjoy it remain pure and separate from anyone creator’s work whom he personally despises, which is rather petty. I have read anything my Moore other than a couple of 80s SWAMP THING issues. So coming into the debate completely blind, I think he’s a bit of a crazy man…

Saj P: for a literary, critical look at both Moore and Morrison, you might enjoy the ongoing analysis at http://www.philipsandifer.com/p/the-last-war-in-albion.html .

What’s odd is I think Moore has a slight point, as Morrison (possible unknowingly) has a slight ego for being a pioneer rather than just a smart writer, as a good portion of Supergods was Morrison praising Morrison for being so awesome to the comics industry, when a lot of his stuff is directly inspired by past comic writers or pop culture.

Then again, Morrison has been pretty open about his influences and does try to give credit due where credit’s due. I have yet to see Moore throw a table-scrapping at anyone or anything that informed his style. He acts like his written work came out of the womb whole like some literary immaculate conception.

Morrison > Moore

Moore realizes that the /bulk/ of his fans are people who like all the stuff he hates, right? Obviously Watchmen pulled in a lot of people who don’t ordinarily read superhero comics, but I’m willing to be that /most/ of those people at least watched the Avengers movie. And a damn large majority of them like Morrison, too.

So any pretense he makes of “respect for his fans” is an absolute lie. These are the same people he’s been insulting for decades.

In terms of attitude, Morrison=Moore. :P They’re both so blasted arrogant!

Mike: try to search the web for past Alan Moore interviews, he has talked a lot about his influences. From Philip José Farmer to Tomas Pynchon to Michael Moorcock to Brian W Aldiss etc. An artist is influenced by other artists (and by reality of course) regardless of the medium in which they work. It’s no like a comic writer must have his/her main influences from another comic book writers, it doesn’t work that way. It’s no like Moore is goign to say ”oh yeah my big influences are Stan Lee, Jim Lee, Geoff Johnes and a guy who wrote Avengers #657 last month”. That’s why he has something to say that’s unique and has a greater vision than most ”comic profesionals” with narrow view, narrow influences, ombliguism, etc. Anyway i am not trying to convince you of nothing, but don’t talk out of ignorace, saying that ”Moore never talk about his influences” That’s plain FALSE.

Remember when Padraig wrote a similar post about two years ago, and Morrison pretty much ripped all the facts presented by Moore to shreds,

http://comicsbeat.com/the-strange-case-of-grant-morrison-and-alan-moore-as-told-by-grant-morrison/

And here we are with passage of time and short memory spans taking effect and Moore is repeating the same information, almost verbatim, without even acknowledging the information has been rebutted. I am under impression now that Moore has created this mythology of himself that he must reconcile at all costs. He comes of as a person that cannot come of terms with the idea that he has successors, let alone contemporaries like Milligan and Morrison. Note that he forgets to mention the name supposed serial murder strip and erotic Vertigo book that Morrison supposedly ripped-off from him. What I am certain of is that Moore is only speaking of his own reflection when he drops the multitudes of personal insults at Morrison(and Skinner and Sneddon).

Maybe it is his disappointment at never being able to be taken seriously as a literary figure or maybe it’s a way to garner free publicity for his actual grasps at high-culture legitimacy. Why is that every time Moore gives one these Last Interviews(What is this, the 5th time?), he magically has a lot of vitriol for comic books and the people who make them even though he doesn’t read any of it and doesn’t *really* care. Coincidentally it is this vitriol that puts him on the culture pages of Guardian and other middle-brow publications, recycling the same information, which is never confirmed by barnacles like Padraig, hurling the same load of feces at anything that does not serve his mythology. How the mighty have fallen indeed! The man who rallied against the term ‘Graphic Novel’ for being pretentious, now disregards all influence of people like Ditko so he can cite Pynchon an an inspiration. I doubt bookstores in Northhampton even carried Pynchon in the late 70′s. All those appearances in Ditko documentaries and Dr. who reference in the black dossier is not going to disappear suddenly, though, and neither will the works of Morrison.

For me it’s simple, all the grown men who still read mostly super-hero/corporate driven comics (like, almost 95% of the usa readership) have a tendency to stick to what Morrison says, because he is basically a superhero writer and nothing more. Even when it’s absolutely clear that he is a Moore plagiarist and that he is a stalker and an offender like he has recetly shown in the HAPPY miniseries.

People who love the medium in general (not just that tiny and almost insignificant part of it, the super-heroes) who is more informed, who was a larger view (not circumspected to Capes and POWS! and macroevents), who respect author-rights, and who respect Moore for his absolutely genius work and creative contribution to the medium and flawless arguments we stick to what Moore says.

Simple as that, dear ”fanboys”.

Sorry, Guido. Nice Try. But if you don’t see that sticking to what one guy says over another makes you just as much a “fanboy” as the other side, then that’s really your own shortsightedness. Take the blinders off, most people who read either and enjoy comics in general couldn’t give two shits, consider this whole “rivalry” a minor interesting story/distraction, and will buy what they feel is entertaining anyway. Get over yourself.

Z-Ram, maybe i didn’t expressed myself properly. I am not saying that I (or I suposse, readers like me, as described above) am going to ”stick to what Moore says” just because he is saying it, but more because i share his points of view about the contemporary USA rotten comic industry and the mediocrity of the ”professionals” working there, from editors to authors, and even readership.

Just the fact that you are saying that comic readers shouldn’t give two shits about this trascendental and landmark interview from one of the best comic writers of all time, reveal the quality and interest of most comic readers in USA now: ”i just want to read my avengers #768 and my superman #675 and my new stupid crossover #1 and i don’t give a shit about anything more, i just wanna get entertained…

Yup Guido you are so jaded, find a new hobby because you are definitely being “that guy”

USA comics industry is rotten, the professionals and even readership are mediocre? Guido, you are as snob as your idol. Obviously you don’t know that nowadays the diversity of comics published is stimulating and Image is revolutionazing comics industry. Mr. Moore is so smug he thinks he is above other comics writers while Grant Morrison thinks he is just a writer among others and doesn’t judge himself superior.

Mr. Padraig is just a fanboy that allowed Mr. Moore to say anything he wanted without any questioning, and if you think that is a “transcendental and landmark interview” what do you think of the historical interview with Richard Nixon made by David Frost, a real journalist?

If Mr. Moore were interviewed by a real journalist and not a fanboy, I doubt he would hold up. Mr. Moore loves to monologue but doesn’t like to dialogue with people with different opinions.

@guido
Morrison has cited his sources, Moore has never done that. He’s being petty because it’s controversial, which gives him attention. For example. Grant Morrison mentioned his affinity for “Chaos Magic” long before Moore decided to label himself as a wizard. There are multiple holes in Moore’s story that he covers up with base insults and cheap hyperbole. Moore has realized that only way to get publicity for his quaint little art-house short film projects is being belligerent and disrespectful.

Also, if you were one of those readers who “is more informed” and “was a larger view”, you would know that Alan Moore does not refer to himself as a comic-book writer anymore and dislikes being referred to as such. You would also know that Morrison has written more sci-fi comics than superhero comics. You would have tried to learn the meanings of *transcendental* and *landmark* in the dictionary, but that’s neither here nor there.

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